After the ACC implemented New Success Initiative Money, Playoff Team Payouts greater than Big 12, ACC Network payouts better than expected, and look-in negotiations going on right now, ACC money is actually now looking very attractive. Not to mention they want to play in CA and be associated with Academic Powerhouses even if FSU and Clemson bolt.

then the math after FSU and Clemson take off.

You want to have a conversation about something that’s going to happen in 3+ years from now, this is the wrong board.

Haven't been determined yet but there will be an extra pool of hundreds of millions of dollars that will get redistributed if that occurs. FSU and Clemson are not leaving for free. Going from 20 cents to over $1 a month in millions of households also won't hurt.

The ACC and B12 need to shove their egos aside and realize that as long as they try to stand alone against the BIG and SEC they will lose. No single conference can match them for size or for established performance. And the mistake is to keep trying to do what's best for just the ACC or what's best for just the B12. They need to view it as a combined enemy. B12/ACC vs BIG/SEC. And the only way to do that is to combine everything. Full merger of ACC and B12 athletics, plus add in San Diego St and Oregon St gets you the following. 36 members (35 full + ND for all but football). 9 teams in Pacific/Mountain time zones 9 teams in Central time zone 18 teams in Eastern time zone (ND plays a bunch of ACC teams each year so I'm counting them) You could do all kinds of interesting scheduling. You would have content all day long. You would have far more large public schools and states under the same media contract (or multiple contracts). And you reduce the impact of the private schools in football by spreading them out. Look at what just the top half of that conference would get for size and coverage. UCF 68,300 est Arizona St. 57,500 mst Arizona 49,400 mst Georgia Tech 47,900 est Houston 46,700 cst Florida St. 45,500 est California 45,300 pst Cincinnati 41,100 est Texas Tech 40,300 cst Colorado 39,500 mst NC State 36,300 est Virginia Tech 36,300 est Oregon St. 35,200 pst Utah 34,700 mst BYU 34,400 mst San Diego St. 32,600 pst North Carolina 30,100 est The bottom half (based on size) would be this. This this group has a ton of great basketball. Iowa St. 29,900 cst Pittsburgh 28,300 est Kansas 26,700 cst Clemson 25,800 est Oklahoma St. 25,300 cst Virginia 25,000 est West Virginia 24,700 est Louisville 21,400 est Syracuse 21,300 est Baylor 20,700 cst Kansas St. 19,700 cst Miami (FL) 17,800 est Stanford 17,300 pst Duke 16,700 est Boston College 14,800 est Notre Dame 12,600 est SMU 12,300 cst TCU 12,200 cst Wake Forest 8,700 est

nothing bores the crap out of me more than another game vs duke or BC for example.....getting some new blood into Lane and some fun roadtrip games like San Diego or Dallas or Corvallis(lol) woudl be a total hoot

If it would somehow then, great. Would regionalize your opponents. The networks drive this and would not be happy about paying a premium for a big conglomeration, IMO.

32 team conference with four divisions (assuming Clemson and FSU are gone and UNC is influenced to stay) Eastern- BC, Syracuse, Pitt, WVU, Cincy, Loserville, UCF and USF Atlantic- VT, UVa, UNC, Duke, Wake, NC St, Ga Tech and Miami Central- Iowa St, Kansas, K State, Okie State, Texas Tech, TCU, Baylor and Houston Pacific- Cal, Stanford, Arizona, Ariz St, Utah, BYU, Colorado and SMU Four division winners play two semifinals the weekend after Thanksgiving and championship game the next week. Since ND will not join as a full member maybe they can go to the Big East. ** Edited by Millpoint at 5/28/2024, 4:47:12 PM ** Edited by Millpoint at 5/28/2024, 4:50:43 PM ** Edited by Millpoint at 5/28/2024, 6:26:52 PM

So therefore it will not happen.

Sorted by size. The ones with yellow highlight on the number of students are the private schools. ** Edited by HokieAl at 5/28/2024, 1:49:02 PM

Taking half shares seems pathetic

Utah fans were praying that the PAC-12 would survive right up to the day the conference imploded (can’t blame them). Their fans were in denial believing that the PAC-12 would survive even without it’s top brands and ESPN agreement. And if all failed, they could find a new home in the B1G if necessary. It was rumored that BYU sponsored Utah for Big 12 membership much like the way a U.S. citizen sponsors a family member from a foreign country for a Permanent Resident Card (Green Card). If not for BYU, Utah could have suffered the same disastrous fate as Calford or equally as bad the same fate as Washington State and Oregon State. Not all, not all, not all but most Utah fans realize how lucky they are to have ended up in a stable conference with a full share of the conference distribution that makes sense geographically. They also now realize that membership in the B1G probably is never going to happen. Look for Utah and BYU to be members of the Big 12 for many many years to come and disregard text messages illogically suggesting otherwise.

12 to 18 months ago, they would have accepted over B12. Lot of non brands in the B12 compared to the ACC.

IIRC, the ACC had an offer out to Ore, Wash, Cal and Stanford very early to join the ACC. I think it was clear to Cal and Stanford that the ACC would take them even without Ore and Wash. Yormark and the B12 would have taken those two, if they were available. He kept saying the B12 would have teams in all four time zones, but they ended up with no one in the Pacific.

The only reason Calford ended up in the ACC was because of a recommendation from a consulting firm hired by Jim Phillips called Fishbait Solutions. They wanted the ACC to exploit the pro rata clause in the ESPN media rights agreement by adding schools. And instead of giving that money to the new additions, the would give 70% to the other ACC members for 7 years or so. In SMU’s case, they would get nothing for 9 years. The whole thing sounds “a little fishy” to me. I can’t imagine ESPN being too happy with having to fork over tens of millions of dollars for three schools with histories of dismal TV ratings on their own. This just added to what seems to be a deteriorating relationship between the ACC and its TV partner so often discussed on this board. It is now less than 8 months from the deadline when ESPN must decide if they are going to extend the media rights contract or not and all you hear from the network on this critically important subject is crickets.

with the B12 podcasters and articles predicting the ACC's demise. Anticipate more of these types of articles, until we know how this shakes out.

It might be the best outcome for both. Not predicting it. But I would certainly be OK with it.

Maybe add a few schools, especially to fill in missing states, like Memphis, Boise, UNLV, Tulane, UAB and UConn, or to add some big markets, like USF and SDSU. Also, add the service academies. Expand the ACCN network over the whole thing.

school that wants to be included, pay the players, and share the total media revenue evenly (football only). Screw the "blue bloods". Negotiate basketball media separately, and let that money finance the athletic departments. I'M TIRED MAN.

take Oregon State, Washington State and Colorado State. Especially if the mag 7 leave, but I am getting more doubtful that anyone leaves in the near future.

If the ACC really wants to get creative, add Hawaii Manoa for football only too. With several other Pacifictime zone already in place, could work schedule so Hawaii only comes east of Pacific Time zone 2 times per year, and only 2 ACC teams east of mountai visit Hawaii each year. Can you imagine what a reward young kids will think being one will be from both sides? ACC expands ACCN footprint more.

recruit to.

I just don't see them making this move. Just like I don't see any ACC teams joining the Big 12 unless a total implosion happens which I believe is unlikely.

FSU. ESPN probably wouldn't care that much if FSU went to the SEC, since they have that contract. My guess is that FSU will pay a very big number to the ACC to leave and then the ACC will pay a decent number to the B12 to get Utah. There are two levels to this - the conferences and the networks. The big number that FSU pays will cover the smaller number that the ACC pays to swap for Utah. It will be a settlement between Fox and ESPN. If it were a baseball trade ESPN trades FSU to B10 (Fox) for Utah who goes to ACC (ESPN). ACC gets Utah and cash B12 gets cash ESPN gets some cash. FSU, B10 and Fox pay cash and B10 gets FSU. The cash that the B12 gets will look like a "departure settlement" that Utah paid. Even if that amount looks like it is big, it will really have come from FSU/B10/Fox and will be a bookkeeping illusion. Maybe it is suboptimal to have multiple schools from any small state in a conference. In which case Kansas and maybe Arizona get traded out also. I think that the ACC has a better core of schools than the B12 - even if FSU and Clemson bail. If ACC gets its act together, they should be able to get back to the #3 conference or pull quite a bit ahead of the B12. These rumors make a lot of sense when you realize that they are trying to re-constitute a bundled product. Fox has B12 and B10. ESPN has ACC and SEC. ACC loses FSU and needs to close the gap as best they can. Fox takes the extra FSU money and carves it up with the B12 to compensate them for losing Utah and sends it back to the ACC. It is basically a swap of Utah for FSU with a net kicker to ESPN and the ACC. I would hope that the ACC could get either Utah plus either Kansas or Arizona in the package. Maybe Wazzu and the Beavs take those two empty B12 spots? This all makes sense when you think about why on earth Cal and Stanford were added. The ACC will have a western and eastern bloc. I'd really like to see the ACC get Utah, Kansas and Arizona out of this. If there are rumors about Utah and/or Kansas, they are probably true and the SEC and B10 are trying to preemptively jump and screw the ACC out of attractive additions so that the ACC will be more likely to unravel. ** Edited by TDVick at 5/28/2024, 8:26:38 AM

Core group of schools. Maybe if Miami and Virginia Tech were still as strong as They once were. But right now I would give the advantage to the Big 12, and would not see much motivation for Utah to move to the ACC. Also, Utah would have to be concerned that More schools might eventually leave the ACC, which is what many people are predicting to happen. Why would they leave a stable conference to join a conference that is likely losing anywhere from 2 to 7 of its best teams. I think the ACC might have a hard time convincing West Virginia to accept an invitation at this point.

Nobody is getting around the GOR. And ESPN isn't screwing themselves out of a very lucrative contract deal with the ACC to let schools go to the B1G and Fox/CBS/NBC. The SEC could preemptively strike, but only after ESPN tells the ACC the contract is done in 2027. That's the only way anybody leaves the ACC before the early 2030's.

get around it because it becomes a minor timing issue. If the price is right, it is better to get an early retirement gift than none at all.

Big 12 already has the Utah market with BYU. Utah is certainly less than thrilled being in the Big 12. They would rather associate with Stanford.

that the Big 12 is actually a joint venture of ESPN/Fox 67%/33% I think?

for how this could get done and I can't guess what the individual bristles on the brush are, but you've got a couple of logjams that need to get cleaned up. 1. Fox compensating ESPN if FSU bails. 2. It will look as thought FSU is paying a lot of freight, but they will get it back from either the B10 and/or Fox. 3. If Utah bails on the B12, the B12 will have to be compensated, which is much less of a hit than FSU bailing on the ACC. 4. Basically Fox would pay ESPN 1/3 of Utah's B12 departure damages if your weights are correct. Fox gets ALL the benefits of FSU. 5. In your scenario, it really doesn't matter to ESPN because they are losing 1/3 or Utah's value to the B12 contract, but gaining the full amount as an ACC member. You would see an entry where someone pays that 1/3 value to the B12. 6. When you book out a deal like this, you show top-line numbers to cover the Network payments, but the tricky part is the specific net payments to the school groups. For ESPN a lot of this is just switching from one pocket to another. There a lots of cross-payment elements. Somewhere, you could see the primary ACC schools using part of the ACC payment to compensate the smaller schools that leave (get booted). At some price the payment outweighs the pain. The two big game changers are this 1) athlete settlement and 2) the possibility of the ESPN unwind. If ESPN can shutdown the contract, then it sort of runs off the smaller ACC schools because there are only 3 years of damages, not 12. The price for compensating the pain seems to have dropped quite a bit this week. As you well know, I've been critical of how things have been handled, but there has to be some sort of logic to the Cal/Stanford additions. I think a lot of schools don't really want to be forced to go B10 or SEC and are cooking up an alternative. I doubt that Louisville and maybe Pitt will be in this new hybrid conference, and it seems to have a significant academic element that probably precludes Louisville and WVU. That's my guess about the landscape. I doubt that VT can hang in the SEC and I don't like B10 snowball fights. I think Door #3 is the way this is looking. ** Edited by TDVick at 5/28/2024, 1:58:51 PM

Fox's money. Here's a nugget from Flugaur, if you choose to accept it: FSU is not using the $30 million media money delta as their rationale for moving. They are anticipating an increase of $80 million a year in the new conference. Increased revenue on a multitude of line items; TV/radio ads, signage, tickets, donations, etc. This may all be just a big sales job to muster fan/donor support. But $80 million is the number they are using to justify the exit from The ACC.

with Utah is very unlikely for a number of reasons. I think the only thing FSU will get back is any revenue share from their future landing spot wherever that might be and they will pay more than was originally thought. I also admit an ACC/Big 12 trade of FSU for Utah is an entertaining thought. I think the logic of the Cal/Stanford/SMU additions is money and the cash concessions primarily and the fact that all 3 have some unique academic and/or athletic fits with the ACC. The thing that needs to be answered is geography. Those 3 out on a limb by themselves are not a long term answer but, it can work short term until the possible alternatives can be evaluated further.

want to straddle the West and East. FSU would get a lot of their expenditure back from Fox and/or B10 because they add a lot of value to those entities. A network will give extra compensation to the B10 once FSU is added and that will get kicked back to FSU to cover the departure fee. Maybe you are right and the ACC was just a desperation pit stop for Cal and Stanford. In which case, we have lot of people reacting and playing hot potato, which I hope is not the case. Their additions could really screw up the ACC's ability to vote their way out of trouble if that is what happened. ** Edited by TDVick at 5/29/2024, 2:28:24 AM

we're a desperation pit stop, I said it will work short term but, for a longer term alternatives must be considered. ND could have had input as well. I would be interested how you believe FSU adds additional value to FOX/B1G over and above a full share at most. If UW and UO only warranted half share I doubt FSU would get more than a full revenue share and any additional funds advanced to fund exit fees would likely be a loan at best repaid from their revenue share. This is not the FSU of Bowden heyday and it remains to be seen whether last year was an anomaly or the beginning of a new trend. No conference can really vote themselves out of trouble and more than likely they(including the ACC) will have to play their way out of trouble. The B1G is the only conference being gifted despite play termed marginal at best and that is likely the reality of FSU's B1G desire as they have been marginal at best in recent times.

About any of this “conference expansion” stuff makes any sense at all, outside of $$$$$!!! It’s pretty sad

If they do, does Cal and Stanford get upgraded also to full share?

1. You can align yourself with CAL, Stanford, and SMU each year... and possible future candidates include AZ, ASU, COLORADO, SDSU, WSU, OSU... with the latter 3 a foregone conclusion if desired. 2. CAL, STANFORD and SMU need some friends. When USC and UCLA joined the B10 it was a foregone conclusion they would expand out west, and there is a similar challenge the ACC now has. 3. While the B12 has some solid teams in FB that have had decent success on the field, they don't have the brand value the ACC does. CLEMSON, MIAMI, FSU, VA TECH, and UNC all have better football brands than any other teams in the B12. An argument could be made that TCU, Baylor, OKSU, WVU are comparable to VT... but I feel those schools are more likely to become irrelevant than the 5 ACC schools mentioned... especially with the departure of Texas and Oklahoma. 4. Utah doesn't want to be with BYU. 5. ACC Network and revenue model. 6. The ACC may be more unstable than the B12, it is only because nobody is attractive enough in the B12 for the SEC or B10. That's pretty telling.

at it. Yormark got the jump on everyone who was scared and needed a landing spot, but I think the ACC could reconstitute itself and make itself quite better than the B12. I also think that this player settlement number has changed things quite a bit, although anyone with a brain should have foreseen this. The ACC can make itself a better league and play out the window until 2027. If ESPN keeps the deal, then they can stay in that format. If ESPN drops the deal then the schools can say they did their best. 1. I don't think most ACC schools want to get their throats cut in the SEC - including UNC. 2. I also don't think ND wants to become a "Midwest team," which is what they will do if they join the B10. 3. Basically every ACC school will become irrelevant in football if they join the SEC. That was at least one consideration for VT back in 2011. I think that eventually the ACC will (or needs to) dump the small schools - Wake, Syr, BC and also Pitt and Louivsille. If I could add school onto the Magnificent 7 (or 5 if Clemson and FSU bail), they would be Kansas Arizona OKST Utah and maybe AZST UCF BYU I doubt that Miami would want UCF and Utah might not want BYU. I love Okie State, they and Utah are by far the best current B12 football schools and are very similar to VT. Somewhere, basketball money is going to be way more important, so grabbing Kansas and Arizona are obvious choices. Duke and UNC really need to be in the same conference for basketball. Every year that is the primary horse race that people watch in the ACC. Ideally the THIRD conference would be UNC NCSU VT UVA Miami Arizona Okie State Kansas Duke Notre Dame That's 10. If they could keep FSU and Clemson, that would be awesome. ND and FSU (Clemson?) would dominate the football landscape. I really like the SMU addition to the ACC and keeping Cal and Stanford would be fine. SMU are going to be very good in football. Even I, as a VT fan, wince and playing a bunch of cold midwestern games. I think the B10 is very boring. I like the SEC much better, but I really don't think we could hang there. I think a lot of schools - when they get past the initial monetary shock are going to look at the SEC and say - "not so fast." If they look at the B10 they will say, "Yuck." I already feel that way now and the non-power 2 schools have a gun to their head. FSU made this calculation once before when they decided to join the ACC. I have think that ND is VERY reluctant as well. Doing a 12 team league in either format allows everyone to protect their main identity UNC, Duke, Kansas and AZ stay whales in hoops ND and Okie State stay relevant in football and maybe FSU and Clemson would stick around if you had performance-based football shares. What I'm laying out could be clumped together in a coherent geography. Maybe someone was thinking ahead when they added SMU, Cal and Stanford. So I think a cherry-picked third league will arise. From a scheduling and entertainment standpoint, I would strongly prefer the "third league" to the B10. Maybe someone could get off their ass, in this age of the internet when there are millions of shoestring podcasters and youtubers and figure out how to make a network or revenue model that could get within 80% of what the B10 brings in. This is the one thing that angers me more than anything else from this process. I think the ACC was colossally mismanaged. If I gave you a list of those 12 schools and said, "Hey try to replicate what the B10 did and try to make between 80% and 100% of what they make," someone worth a crap should be able to accomplish that. Problem solved. I'd love to get some large sunbelt schools like Arizona and Arizona State way more than Wisconsin or Iowa. ** Edited by TDVick at 5/28/2024, 7:06:57 AM

TCU, K-State, WVU all would fit real nice. Under your scenario is ND all in or a hybrid?

academic rankings. You've got to figure that the ringleaders are UNC, maybe Notre Dame, Stanford and Cal, etc. I don't want to sound like a snot but VT won't be in the top half academically. Like I said. I think we part ways with Louisville and that WVU isn't part of it. ** Edited by TDVick at 5/28/2024, 2:07:09 PM

to care about money, since they have so much. Back in 2011 I was saying that only way the ACC could stay relevant was to get Texas and ND. This strategy would basically switch Texas with A&M. I think A&M is really pissed about Texas getting invited to the SEC and would like to have a chance to win - which they aren't able to do now. ** Edited by TDVick at 5/28/2024, 7:18:48 AM

with it.

around for conferences again. Jimbo was bad news to start. Elko might be able to get them on the right path, though that might be quite a monumental task since he’s already *****ing about players playing video games too much. ** Edited by RJHokie at 5/28/2024, 7:22:20 AM

Both their states have larger populations that Utah re: ACCN subs. The differences are only marginal though so maybe it doesn't matter. Might be nice to get a team in the Mountain Time Zone though. An Utah is better in football and academics. So. Anyway. Just thinking out loud here.

they go to the B12 and the ACC gets Arizona and Kansas. UNC would love this - I would think. Plus ND will always lurking around to milk the ACC and they are academically focused as well.

The Utah fan base was dissing the Big 12 all,over the internet just a few days before Utah accepted the Big 12 invite. Utah looks like another malcontent just like FSU. Utah was in the WAC and in the MWC as recently is 2010. Now they think they are a football powehouse with a little recent success. Real prima-donnas.

1. Over a decade ago, there were big plan to all but merge the XII and the Pac-10. Texas, Texas A&M, Colorado, Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, and Texas Tech, plus the 10 existing Pac teams were going to make up a new Pac-16. 2. For one reason or another, A&M wasn't down with it, so they decided this would be a good time to go their own way, and join the SEC. 3. At word of this, the Pac-10 gave Colorado a solo invitation (which it accepted) in hopes of pressuring Texas and the rest of them to join. Texas, et al. didn't take the bait (and UT didn't want to give up Longhorn Network), and the deal fell though. 4. But now that Pac was at 11, and they needed a 12th. So there was Utah. Kinda like how Mizzou got into the SEC. I am pretty sure that had Texas, OU and whoever the other three were who coming along had joined the Pac-16, I doubt Utah would have been invited. It's been a while, and the details are a little sketchy to me without looking it up, but this is how I recall it going down. ** Edited by Maroon Baboon at 5/28/2024, 12:02:58 AM

been inclined and allowed to do so. The cards had fallen almost perfectly in line.

No like for BYU is part of it. I believe they jumped to the Big 12 out of desperation.

Utah treasures its academic as well as academic excellence. They enjoy playing with their university peers from USC, UCLA Stanford Cal and Wash and Oregon. They see the ACC as a conference of like minded institutions. (actually my opinion had a lot of the same culture as the old Pac 12. If you get FSU to settle with a high fee to the acc, plus getting Utah and maybe one more, that maybe generates different fee structure doing the look in pattern. as much as clemson is going to cork, I do think if they can get the $$$, they can cool down. FSU is a lost cause.,, but again who knows!!!!!!!!! this is really crazy stuff

and could be another twist. Give me them and WVU, and football will have two more passionate football fan bases in the ACC. Yeah just wishful thinking on WVU, but crazier things have happened in Conference Realignment. ** Edited by Stech at 5/27/2024, 10:53:11 PM

I like the idea of merging the best of the Big 12 and ACC to form a solid conference. ** Edited by Millpoint at 5/28/2024, 10:55:35 AM

won't keep it's Southern Association rating!! It's a step above Liberty, but not by much.

(somewhat) Virginia have multiple in-state edu competitors. WVU should be WV's crown jewel, but...

and exacerbated it with Gee at the helm. Plus the state’s finances and education system are among the worst in the nation too.

Is getting Utah a game changer for either conference? No. Does anyone care that Utah is still big mad over the breakup of the Pac-12, and probably has regrets about where they ended up? No. Does anyone care that they have a hang up with BYU? No. Is it something to talk about? I guess. My take on Utah: overachieving program that is good enough to win a conference, but for some reason, no one wants them to. Could you imagine if they were in the ACC and won it? The talking heads would somehow say, "this is bad for the ACC."

Read through the Wikipedia entry linked below...it's like the Montagues and the Capulets. A guy I used to work with was a BYU alum and described it all to me -- I don't know if there's a rivalry in the country that includes as much visceral hatred and disdain for the other school.

Watch for aTm to the ACC if Big TX follows them to the B1X...lol

But never forget, the vast majority of these rumors have zero basis in fact. Most of the news on realignment, including the "imminent death of the ACC" and FSU's lawsuit is coming from social media where the number of clicks directly drives the revenue generated So the best way to make money, is to make **** up, or repeat made up **** from somewhere else and blast a headline. The fact that none of it is ever true, doesn't stop people from clicking the link (just look at the number of YouTube links to utter BS from some dude in his mom's basement get posted here and generate long threads). You'd think at some point, people would realize they are being suckered by 21st century con-men, but they don't, they keep watching the videos and endlessly debating the potential merits of crap that was just made up to generate clicks. It would be amusing if it wasn't so sad.

sell some deliberate lies. But most of what I see is football infected fans who suddenly get a new epiphany into the secret clockworks of realignment. They need to shout it from the mountain tops before someone beats them to it. I restrain myself everyday from posting some hare-brained realignment confection based on a fleeting factoid I saw on the web. This is entertainment and a diversion. Nobody gets hurt unless they take it all too seriously. Talk about CR theories, Hell, I got a million of 'em.

and AZ, AZ St, Col. and Utah in the big 12 for a temporary time until they can reconstitute the new mid level PAC. Again just an opinion but mine is big media and the power 2 need a Triple A minor league and they see either one "conference" with 3 divisions or 3 separate conferences of 10-12 each. These will produce their own content to "sell" to big media for televising in certain time slots. Big media will no longer produce or be forced to air BC vs Wake and similar games whether in the PAC, Big 12 or ACC.

...Cal, Stanford and SMU made exponentially more sense for the ACC right now than the four corners schools because of the increase in in-state carriage fees for the ACC Network. CA+TX is about 4x as many subscribers as AZ+UT+CO I recall a tweet a few months back that (jokingly) proposed a trade of SMU/Cal/Stanford for WVU/Cincy/UCF. I think that whenever cord-cutting hits an inflection point and conference networks are no longer the obscene money maker they are now, we'll see another rearrangement.

be able to compete, and afford to pay their players on a close enough level to compete. The P2 is nothing without the rest of college sports and teams.

You cannot stop Vienna Hokie, you can only hope to contain him. Love it.