Tricky child raising moment from the weekend re. firearms.
I moved in with the then girlfriend/now fiance about a year ago. Since then, we've bought a house together, sold both of our homes, and finished moving to the new house last week.
When I moved in with her, she had a couple of firearms stored at her parents house. I had several more that we moved into the bedroom closet. They were all secured with trigger/bolt locks, but we did not have a gun safe.
But during the move last week, it came to light that the youngest child wasn't aware we both owned firearms,and has apparently been indoctrinated that they are scary and evil by some combination of school and pop culture. We had a conversation with her that firearms need to be respected and handled safely, but they are nothing to be scared of (unless they are being pointed at you, then you should rightfully be terrified). A gun that is just sitting there isn't something to fear.
As a result, we did go get a gun safe over the weekend, and they are all now locked up in the safe. I'm pretty sure her mom is going to take her to the range and at least teach her to shoot a .22 rifle just so she knows the absolute basics of firearm safety and maybe get over a little of her fear.
Any other tips for unbrainwashing a kid that has learned to be terrified of firearms? To my way of thinking, every adult should understand the basics of all our Constitutional rights (what you can say and write in public, your rights if you are charged with a crime, how to research who you should vote for and what going to the polls is like, and at least the fundamentals of safe gun ownership). If you choose to never vote or own a gun, that's your choice, but you should still know how to.
When I got my first firearm, I called both of my kids over (the youngest was probably 6) and explained there are now firearms in the house, this is what they look like, and here are the rules. These are currently unloaded and completely safe, so if you are curious, go ahead and pick it up (without pointing the barrel at anyone!) and look at it. When they got a little older, I took them to the range, and they both enjoyed shooting. My daughter...because this is the kinda thing she would do...even made a bracelet out of the spent brass. I think I got to my kids young enough that they had a respect, but not a fear of firearms. But now I've got a 12yo in the house who is clearly scared of them and I'm trying to figure out the best course.
36 Replies
2y
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
The Youth Interest Program is also very gooderly.
I'm a Lifetime NRA Member and a NRA Patriot for Life Member...
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
Balloons, metal and other reactive targets. Most important a safety class and test every time they meet. Plenty of certified instructors supervising. The kids, boys and girls. Love it! If you hunt and fish some of the best times I had with my Dad were in the woods or trout fishing.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
First, I'd start with having a conversation with your step daughter about why she finds firearms frightening. I think before you can bring her around and have any chance at changing the way she perceives firearms, she will first need to feel that you understand where she is coming from and that you respect her feelings.
This is probably going to be a process that has to play out over time, so I wouldn't necessarily jump into this next part on day one, but as you discuss firearms and begin to explain why you feel it is important to own them, I would relate it to the fear she has. You can point out that one of the primary reasons you own a gun is to protect her and everyone else in the home from people who do not respect laws or the wellbeing of others. You might want to relate it to something simple like stealing - theft is against the law, but people obviously do it all of the time anyway. Similarly, if everyone always obeyed all laws, there would be much less need to for protecting your loved ones, but unfortunately the "bad guys" are going to break laws, and if they are the only ones with guns, things go sideways pretty quickly. So you could ask her what makes her more afraid: living in a house where there is a gun that could be used by someone who loves her to protect her, or a being in a house where there are no guns when a "bad guy" with a gun breaks in and has bad intentions. You could even cite a few recent examples from the news, such as in Toronto where the police have begun to encourage citizens to leave their car keys on their front porches overnight so that car thieves do not attempt to break into residences to steal the keys, because most Canadians do not have firearms to use in protecting themselves.
As the conversation develops over time, you can extend it explain the real reason for the Second Amendment (which is obviously to guard against a tyrannical government), which the founding fathers had just recently escaped and had no desire of finding it necessary to do so again in the future. I was able to navigate that discussion with my own daughter by relating it to her being forced to do things she doesn't want to do, using taxation as an example. I broke it down in terms that she would understand, such as doing jobs around the house in exchange for money, but then only receiving a small percentage of that money due to an onerous "tax" that she had no say in. She did not like that idea at all and saw that it would be unfair, so I explained that is an example of tyranny, and that is what our founding fathers recognized as a very real danger when they set up our form of government. They knew from both studying history and from firsthand experience that if a government feels it can opress its citizens without pushback, it will eventually do so. However, if a government has to continually be mindful that if it pushes its citizens too far, they could revolt (and by doctrine, would feel not only the right but the duty to do so), then that government is much more easily kept within the limits prescribed by its founding documents/constitution.
I don't think this is going to be a "one and done" conversation, but I've found that kids can be persuaded on many topics when you respect their opinion and can frame your rebuttal in ways that they can easily understand. Sometimes a mock example can make an ambiguous situation feel very tangible to a child. Good luck.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
walk any of it back and just keep on the course you've charted.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
Explaining why you value them may make them less scary to your daughter.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
Most arguments for gun rights have to do with sport, hunting, or personal protection in the time between when things hit the fan and when law enforcement can arrive and get things under control.
I personally have two reasons why I think responsible gun ownership is important. Reason one is I think there is a very realistic possibility for a period of civil unrest in the wake of either a natural or political disaster, and there could very well be a period where we are all on our own to protect ourselves, our families, and our property from rioters/looters for hours or days until the National Guard can get things under control again. I don't think it's probable, but it is possible. So I prefer to be prepared.
Reason two is I believe in the premise that all governing bodies of the United States only exist and operate under the expressed, written consent of We The People. The moment the government disarms The People, or The People voluntarily disarm themselves, then that written consent becomes unenforceable.
If our elected leaders ever lose their path by enough that a revolution becomes necessary (the Declaration of Independence even outlines that as our responsibility as The People), we have the obligation to overthrow that government and replace it with something new. But if the government is armed and The People are not, that's not possible.
I readily admit the second reason is mostly theoretical. I don't foresee a need to violently overthrow our own government in my lifetime. But that day probably will come eventually, and I would hate to have our 2A rights crippled today in the spirit of good intentions and public safety just so our descendants are sentenced to life under tyrannical rule because we signed away their ability to overthrow the tyrant.
That's a lot of gloom and doom thinking to dump on a 12yo. I view it as precautionary preparedness, much like carrying insurance. But I think all that would be hard to explain to a kid without either scaring them more or sounding like you're paranoid.
(In response to this post by HokieHigh)
2y
You and I are of like mind (see my post above), and I've been able to explain those exact same reasons to my daughter, who is only 11 now. She "got it" right away and didn't seem threatened or scared at all by the premise. Perhaps it helped that during COVID, when I was starting to see what I would characterize as gross government overreach with certain measures, we read the Declaration of Independence together at the dinner table over the course of several nights. My daughter certainly didn't understand the Declaration as written, so I tried to summarize it in kid terms as we went along. It seemed to stick, because when we talked about the government having to worry about pushback from an armed populace, she didn't bat an eye.
I think I'd start with just listening to your step daughter's fears and see where it goes from there. It will definitely be something to discuss slowly over time.
** Edited by MP4VT2004 at 4/1/2024, 11:04:14 PM
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
a pretty coherent argument, even for a 12 year old. You don't need to scare your kid but the insurance argument seems like one that could resonate. Guns don't have to be scary unless you make them scary.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
I was trying to explain what happened, what happens next, and that since no one was injured, it was just one of those unfortunate life accidents that can happen to anyone, and not something to be shaken up about. When I got to the part about filing a claim with insurance, that led to "what is insurance?"
I tried to explain how insurance is you paying someone else a little money every month to protect yourself from the unlikely event of something bad. But if something bad does happen, then insurance pays for it instead of you. I tried to make it as kid-friendly an explanation as I could, but she still glazed over and zoned out. The insurance analogy works great for adults, but I'm not sure it works in this case.
(In response to this post by HokieHigh)
2y
house full of firearms, and started hunting with my dad at age 7 (carrying a BB gun). I'd see if she would be willing to go to the range one day and shoot the .22.....no kick to it and it's not all that loud. A very good gun to start. She may enjoy it and grow to like it. If she doesn't like it then go over the house rules and let her know that they will be locked up safely out of harms way. But then again I've never been around anyone that close who hates having guns around so I may not have sound advice.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
avid hunter. Both sides of the family (boys, girls, men and women) knew how to handle firearms. I was taught at a very young age that guns aren't toys. Respect them and don't play with them. Treat every gun as though it's loaded.
When I was 11 yo Dad got me a .22 Mag/.410 Savage over/under...Great gun that my grandnephew has now.
Dad wasn't much of a pistol man but I certainly am. My wife and I have rifles but we love our hand guns.
(In response to this post by Nortazhokie)
2y
Got my first gun - a .410 single-shot Revelation (that was the Western Auto brand) when I was in the fifth grade. Got my first buck with it when I was in my second year at VT. I would constantly complain to Dad that I pretty much had no chance with a single-shot .410, and that I needed a rifle. He replied that, if I was good enough, I only would need one shot. He was true to his word: One shot was all I needed. Great memories. And yes, I've still got the gun. It'll throw a slug.
(In response to this post by Major Kong)
E
EDGEMAN
2y
I've wanted a Ruger 77/22 for years, but never got around to buying one until recently, then I found they no longer made it in .22LR, so the search continued. I was ready to pull the trigger on a CZ 457, then I stumbled across the American made Christensen Arms Ranger. I also bought a Leopold rimfire scope similar to the one in the picture...lol
My advice: if you really like something, go ahead and buy it. Firearms are not something that will go bad, and I seriously doubt any owner will ever shoot the rifling out of a .22LR barrel.
(In response to this post by Nortazhokie)
E
EDGEMAN
2y
The old Crossman pump BB gun.
** Edited by EDGEMAN at 4/2/2024, 6:57:21 AM
(In response to this post by MP4VT2004)
E
EDGEMAN
2y
...when teenagers start to drive, let them know an automobile can be as dangerous as a firearm. They need to maintain focus on driving, and not talking to friends or texting when they are behind the wheel.
Just like a firearm, it shouldn't be scary, but something they need to approach professionally every time they get behind the wheel.
(I swear I see someone doing something really stupid every time I'm on the highway, and would bet it's a distracted driver 90% of the time.)
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
H
Hurley09
2y
"Focus on the road, no texting and driving, no fiddling with your phone.... by the way, check out the all new model car with a 72" iPad screen right on the dashboard for you to mess with. Want to turn up the music? Gone are the days of slightly reaching over and feeling around for the right knob without taking your eyes off the road. Try the new and improved method where you have to be looking at the screen in order to do anything. SAFETY!" I think the older I get the more I just hate technology. I feel like we've gone far enough, can we just stop making new stuff?
(In response to this post by EDGEMAN)
E
EDGEMAN
2y
"on/off volume knob."
You shouldn't have to use a touchscreen to adjust the volume. It's definitely distracting.
(In response to this post by Hurley09)
At 12? Hmmm, that one could be tough.
I think I shot my first shotgun when I was like six or seven and grew up around guns, so for me, seeing a gun is as natural as seeing just about anything else that you might find when going through somebody's closet. But 12? That might be different. But yeah, getting mom to take her to the shooting range is the best way.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
loving them and respecting them. Guns can be scary if kids are unfamiliar with them. The news is full of people getting shot and kids murdered in school shootings. I'm not surprised she might be scared of them.
(In response to this post by Chris Coleman)
2y
We did go to the range and shoot 22's in boy scouts, I had a BB gun growing up (and never did shoot my eye out), and we'd go out and shoot pie pans and soup cans with shotguns on my grandaddy's farm. I wasn't regularly exposed to firearms, but I was taught the basics and they certainly weren't taboo or something I was ever told to stay away from.
Like almost any topic with political undertones, the very idea of a firearm can be polarizing with strong pro or anti opinions depending on who you are talking to. I certainly don't care if she ever chooses to own a firearm (although women who are afraid of having a firearm confuse me a little, I would think a small device that makes you the physical equal of anyone who wishes you harm would be liberating, not something to be afraid of), but I'd still like her to not be afraid of them.
(In response to this post by Chris Coleman)
2y
… fear of anything is often best addressed with familiarity. Let her watch others shoot targets for fun. Don’t make her shoot right away, let her get comfortable. Then at some point, maybe a later visit, give her an opportunity with a .22 and targets, and give a lit of praise. My 2 cents.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
i would def call it that
kids today are a complete emotional mess as we make the mistake of allowing them to be “taught” by activists…the result?
i think the linked story from cnbc says it all
(In response to this post by WestyHokie)
2y
I didn’t grow up with guns. I’m 60. Guns bothered me because we had no reason to have them, and screwing up could mean hurting someone. I wanted to learn about them to better understand, so I took an NRA class in 2014. Helpful, but still uncomfortable. Then I went shooting with a friend in security. Today I own multiple guns, and am still learning. I was not brainwashed. But I did need to get more comfortable with something with potentially serious consequences. As for kids and stress today, well, we raised them and social media warped them. But that’s a different tale.
(In response to this post by MrBayAreaHokie)
You missed the entire point of my post, but maybe the bourbon is flowing
(In response to this post by WestyHokie)
2y
how to shoot a pistol. Kid was probably about 12 as well, if I had to guess.
I saw them go through all the basics of safe gun handling, and it was obvious the kid was tentative and a bit scared. When it was finally his turn to actually fire the gun, he pointed it at the target and sssssllllloooooooooooooowwwwwlllyy pulled the trigger. Probably took over ten seconds of squeezing the trigger before it fired. Kid was cringing and leaning away from the gun the whole time he was squeezing the trigger.
But then it fired. And the bullet hit the target (granted, the target was probably 8 feet away). And the kid got a smile on his face as big as Christmas morning and proceeded to empty the next 9 rounds in the magazine within probably 3 seconds. John Wick would have been proud.
Sometimes just firing a gun in a controlled and safe setting is all it takes to get over the fear. But not every time.
(In response to this post by WestyHokie)
2y
We would go with Dad to the local shooting match each Wednesday when we were in elementary school. If we wanted to shoot (which every boy out there wanted to do), we had to shoot his 12 gauge Remington 870. We'd hear tales from the other kids how badly the gun would kick. "Urban legends" circulated about how certain guns would give you a black eye after pulling the trigger. And given the fact that there were lots of men out there watching, it made the scenario even scarier. Yeah, the first time I shot, I just wanted to get it over with. But after realizing that the so-called "kick" wasn't that bad - especially if you held the gun correctly, it was fun! Dad probably didn't want us going with him after that moment, as we'd want to shoot every match, with him paying for it. :-) Good memories!
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
E
EDGEMAN
2y
Not so much for the .22, but what everyone around them will be shooting.
Single hearing protection is more than enough for a .22 rifle.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
I'm only half kidding...but you and her mom are seemingly doing what you should. Can't rush it.
(In response to this post by Tafkam Hokie)
2y
from a parent of another kid about violent imagery in the classroom he was highly concerned about.
My first thought was "ugh, I wonder what my kid drew in class today" since he had an affinity for sketching monsters at that age.
Turns out the "violent imagery in the classroom" was a lifesize cardboard cutout of the soldier stationed in Afghanistan that the 3rd grade class was pen pals with. The cutout showed the soldier dressed in full kit, including (duh) his rifle.
If it was possible to audibly roll your eyes, that's what I did. I thought it was indescribably awesome that they were pen pals with a soldier and had a cutout of him in the classroom.
(In response to this post by vthokieq)