.....their goals. I do not necessary take this as an indictment on our current coaching staff. A

Because it's not. ** Edited by laphroaig at 5/22/2025, 4:17:42 AM

Presumably, Grein is going to be better purely from being a year older. It really serves no purpose to bring up Grein other than to look for trouble. There can be discussions about the staff, but there is no way to know how she would do here this year, with this staff, with this offense, with this schedule. Comparing her numbers and saying her development is better elsewhere can't be proven. Odds are she has a relatively great year here, but odds are, she does not get 25 starts here. So "relatively great" does not translate into anything close to a 28-2 record. This year, we played 56 games: Emma had 24 starts Mazzarone had 18 starts Kleiman had 11 starts Grizzard had 3 starts If Grein stays, Kleiman does not come, which is fine in the scheme of things. Say that Grein gets Kleiman's 11 starts and likely Grizzard's 3. That is 14 starts. Is Mazzarone going to lose starts? Will Lemley lose starts in her senior year? To actually take advantage of a developed Grein, she would cut Mazzarone's starts nearly in half? We would have potentially lost Mazzarone to transfer if she came into 2025 looking at getting 7-9 starts. At Oregon, she was the co-ace of the staff. With more responsibility, she was likely going to mature, develop mentally, etc. She could have been the co-ace here and maybe had similar levels of responsibility but Lemley would have been ace no. 1. At what price? Maybe there would have been willingness among the fans to lose Mazzarone and likely have 1-2 of the freshmen be the 3rd pitcher. I have no idea whatever other issues existed. The larger point is would fans want to lose as much as or more than we gain? ** Edited by VAHokie89 at 5/20/2025, 8:49:18 PM ** Edited by VAHokie89 at 5/20/2025, 8:52:15 PM ** Edited by VAHokie89 at 5/20/2025, 9:00:19 PM ** Edited by VAHokie89 at 5/21/2025, 12:21:37 AM

under the bridge. But, one thing people do on these message boards (all the time) is assess our coaching staffs. And I think that is the point of HH2000 comment. You said "Presumably she is going to be better purely from being a year older." Per the stats presented, neither Lemley OR Mazz got better this year. So, your presumption isn't supported. You can't assume that about Mazz for next year. She seems to have a lot of upside. Our pitchers were very good. I am not criticizing them. The only thing we do know is that Grein did get better in a different situation and our pitchers didn't here. In watching the Oregon games in the tournament, the commentators mentioned that LG is an emotional player. That kind of player does not fit well here. Keely Rochard is a perfect example. If you watched her walk off the field after the end of an inning, you had no idea if she just struck out the side or gave up 6 runs. She and Pete (and the pitching coach) were a great fit and she thrived here. It is true that we don't know if LG would have developed here like she did there. That was for her to figure out. And she did. LG had to know that she would not be the top ace of the staff until Lemley graduated. So, that could not have been her expectation. She is OK with being co-ace at Oregon. Maybe not a 3rd ace which she was last year and would have been this year at VT. Maybe she believed she needed more innings to thrive. Also remember, we had a different pitching coach when she came here. Maybe Josh and LG weren't a good fit. Next year, our pitching staff will be 100% Josh's group. Mazz will have to get better to help replace Lemley. We'll see how that goes. ** Edited by nkhooch at 5/21/2025, 5:11:46 AM

Staffs’ ability to keep players. It’s just the college sports world now. If some team has a surplus of talent at specific positions this is especially true

Lemley got better from year 1 to year 2. She also better from year 2 to 3 and she did expand her pitch repertoire going into her senior year. Her HR numbers improved in general. She became a good enough pitcher to be drafted by a professional league. So how much she improved can be debated. I do think that grein has more upside. Lemley didn't plateau but she was probably reaching the ceiling she could reach in college. Mazzarone did improve in certain aspects so you cant say she didnt improve. She isnt the same pitcher as last year. To say she didn't improve does her a disservice. She needs to continue to improve and go from adding strength/velocity to developing better control with more work and games started. Sure, questioning the staff is a legitimate exercise. I don't agree with the thought that grein’s emotions didnt make her a good fit. Did Rachel castine’s emotions after hitting the HR against alabama make her not a good fit? Grein was not an emotional basket case. She showed grit and emotion after finishing off georgia. Finally, lemley isn't so stoic. To make that something is just making something . Looking at someone doing better or growing somewhere else is a favorite past time of Hokies fans, especially on men’s basketball.

statistics. How did their statistics change from year to year? HH2000 laid that out. Nothing here is intended to be a knock or a "disservice" to a player. I am certain our pitchers work hard to improve every year. I am sure there are elements that improve. But, as is done with every athlete whose performance can be represented with statistics, that's where results are ultimately judged. HH2000 compared the changes in statistics from 3 players. 1 got noticeably better (and yes SOS could have something to do with it, but in the schedule she had some great performances against some ranked opponents) but hard to argue to all of it. The other 2 didn't. Statistically, Lemley's best year was her first one. Her second was her worst and the pitching coach issues contributed to that. And you could attribute that, in part, to simply having a pitching coach and the NCAA rule enforcement. We also tried to make her a 2-game starter every weekend and she pitched a lot more innings. And didn't have the success there as we did with Rochard. So, because year 2 was her worst, year 3 was much better. But, statistically, year 3 was still not as strong as year 1. And year 4 was slightly worse than year 3 in several aspects. Here are Lemley's stats over the 4 years. Judge for yourself. https://hokiesports.com/sports/softball/roster/player/emm... The point is, you cannot assume Mazz is going to get better just because she is a year older. I can give you countless examples of players who don't get better every year. And yes, that may not all be attributable to coaching. But, it does beg the question in Grein's case. Yes, it is correct, that pitcher's have celings and it could be that EL and EM hit theirs already. We are not assessing whether or not EL is a good pitcher. She was a very good pitcher. So, being drafted is irrelevant. She may well have been drafted in year 1 or year 3 but that wasn't an option in those years. In her freshman year, she made the top 3 among freshman in the entire country. I didn't say Grein was an emotional basket case. You keep generating defenses against things that are not being said. I am not talking about celebrating an on-field success. Good grief. And it's not just what happens during a game on the field. How they react to tough situations, correction, etc. It's extra tough for pitchers, because every time they pitch they know full well that at any time, if things don't go well, they can be taken out of a game. And that decision is out of their hands.

Calls. Worse record. 3.68 ERA. Then the next year they change the rules. Same thing happened to Puladki Co. Cougar Football. They got hit with a pra tice violation that carried some very hefty penalties. The very next year they ok'ed it.

Excellent analysis.

trolling looking for a sparing partner.

Not trolling at all. Genuinely curious that Grein's numbers have improved this year (year older, yes, new conference, yes), but two pitchers on VT's staff (who also are a year older) have stayed stagnant over two years in the program. The other transferred in, and has probably improved since being at VT. Do folks feel, in general, that VT's staff has developed, is what I'm meaning to ask. ** Edited by hokiehigh2000 at 5/20/2025, 7:03:48 PM

impact of coaching. And people care about that.

FSU, Stanford, UNC, Liberty, LSU, Alabama, UVA, Cal …that’s 21 games vs top 20-25 offenses

a little apples and oranges comparison. In the B1G and NCAA tournaments, she had the following numbers: 15 2/3 Inn 19 Hits 17 Runs 11 ER This includes a 5 inning 3 hit shutout of Weber State. I hope she does well this weekend and has a great senior season. I just don't think just looking at numbers is the whole picture. I agree with Chip that she is maturing, and I hope she finishes her career strong. ** Edited by 133976Hokie at 5/20/2025, 6:30:30 PM ** Edited by 133976Hokie at 5/20/2025, 6:31:01 PM

continue rooting for them. Don't want to see anything bad happen to them, just no reason to root for them. No different than anyone who never played for VT. Go Flames.

I am not so sure her numbers are as good with Tech's schedule. Maybe I am completely wrong though, but we will never know.

BUT in the last weeks of the season she gave up a bunch of runs and HR

“This year I’ve really just bought into the mental side of the game and just being mentally tough as well as physically tough, and I think that’s really helped me,” Grein said. There are things that happened at VT last year that would reinforce that statement, but is there any real purpose is going there? She decided to transfer to Oregon and it has worked out great for her and Oregon. Time to move on.

Would be easy to move on. I think it’s ok to ask if there is something wrong here. Love these girls and the team but what is preventing VT from taking the step to elite? Each year we are right on it and can’t seem to get over it. If the best players stayed, it would make us feel like we are getting there but watching them leave each year certainly makes you step back and ponder what’s going on.

Only real contributors I can recall are pitchers, because we use several of them. Some want more playing time, so our #2,3,4 end up leaving. Grein was the only significant loss I can recall in recent years, and she was our #2 in playing time.

It is rare for the best players to leave. Most of the time, the players who are leaving are either not starters or rotational players seeking more playing time. Grein is likely an exception. What has been apparent is that we have largely replaced losses. Youth at key spots might hurt the offense. If we are not elite, it isn't because of players transferring out. Just keep the analysis simple. Pitching is very good, but there is not a Jordy Bahl or a Canady on the roster. As good as we can be, we have lapses. Even minor ones can hurt Batting...we can hit over .300 as a team and hit 100+ HRs, but certain players in the lineup are hitting below .250 and even better hitters might go through a 2-3 week spell of not hitting a HR... Losing some games 3-2 or 4-3 is the difference between advancing and not advancing. Some random transfer is not the reason for not advancing. ** Edited by VAHokie89 at 5/21/2025, 10:28:21 AM

Look around- that’s nothing. With Mr billionaire knight funding their athletic budget they should be able to get anyone they want.

helped her there. Good for her.