Who thinks ACC will be fine?
If not where does VT end up? I've not really been following this and rarely visit message boards these days.
44 Replies
W
WBGV
2y
Most people think that it is a foregone conclusion that FSU and Clemson are gone. ESPN hasn’t announced if they are going to exercise the Nine-Year option in their media rights agreement as the deadline for a decision fast approaches. The ACC just expanded, but with three schools that the SEC, Big 12, and B1G didn’t want. Member schools (at least 7) have been meeting behind the commissioner’s back trying to devise exit strategies. The ACC is being sued by its two most valuable members and in turn is suing them. Also, the Attorney General of Florida is now suing the conference for documents pertaining to an undervalued media rights agreement. If it overcomes these issues, the ACC will be fine.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
and rather than give my irrelevant opinion on the ACC, I will tell you guys that we out here have gone through what you guys are discussing today.
The B12 dissolved, and basically didn't exist. It was Big 10/SEC for my school, or bust. All was lost.
Today, we have a football schedule, access to the playoffs, parity from top to bottom, and an excitement I have not seen in quite some time.
No matter what happens to these "conferences", VT will play football, fill their stadium, have access to the playoffs, and compete at the highest levels across the board - just like all of us in the new conference they call the B12.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
toll and those not in the richest conferences will not be able to compete at the highest levels.
(In response to this post by Big12 guy)
2y
add up to the rest of the B12 not being competitive? Did Texas dominate that conference? I seems to me, that many fans may be panicking because of the reported disparity in the media contracts.
The game changer is the playoff money in my opinion. VT could win the thing, but a Purdue that didn't participate gets more revenue? I call BS on the guaranteed playoff revenue, but currently, there isn't another option.
How about the B12, ACC, PAC, and all the G5 conferences start their own playoff, see what the bids are, and let the revenue go to the teams (conferences) that participate, and reward the winners.
Looking at the media contracts, and how they value the P2 compared to the B12 and ACC, it's 2+ to 1 in the P2s favor. Would another playoff format get a CBS, or a FOX, or a streamer to bid on a playoff with 80% of the FBS schools participating?
Let the P2 duke it out, and see how much ESPN bids on their playoffs without the rest of us. Hell, we weren't invited to the cool kids party anyway, so lets throw our own party. I'd watch, would you?
(In response to this post by Two4VT)
2y
1. SEC
2. Big 10
3. Revised ACC
4. Big 12
I want VT to be where the money is. If they lose the lottery than I say focus on academics and go with the revised ACC.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
Then again, I don't understand why the Big 12 thinks it is so safe. It's all about the SEC and Big 10.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
V
VPI_1998
2y
universities coming and going ever since they started, so I would bet they are used to it and act as such. They certainly moved quickly after UW and Oregon announced their move.
(In response to this post by HokiesACC2004)
The ACC hasn't been fine for a while. Two signs of illness: ND and Maryland
Heathy conferences don't invite partial members for major sports (football and MBB).
And long-standing, charter members don't leave the conference in the way UMd did. Maryland's best sport was MBB, and they left the best MBB conference. For what? More money? Yes. And it was a foreshadowing of what was coming if anyone was paying attention. Anyone with a money problem and was marketable in some way, had a home in the P2 that they could just jump ship for.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
"Conference ACC", in my opinion...
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
ESPN and Notre Dame want it to. I believe FSU, Clemson and Carolina are gone. At least one, maybe more, will follow. Teams that will be added to the ACC will have to pass the "Irish" test. As a WVU fan I'd love to see VPI, Pitt and Loserville in the Big 12 but I believe at least Pitt and Tech will stay in the ACC if no P2 invite occurs.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
They are tied fo the nc system and the nc system wants to make sure state is coverered. Then the nc general assembly is working on stete rule requiring regular scheduling in football between all nc public schools. This means app state ecu and charlotte.
Btw the state system is digging into unc operation to ensure comsistency between the state schools. Already chapel hill administration is complaining of not having independence. Appears unc wealthy alumni who give alot to unc chapel hill not pleased-
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
2y
VT will most likely end up in the SEC. Anything less than the Power 2 will be totally unacceptable. That is the same attitude and expectation you and all the rest on this board should have. I certainly hope the rest of the fanbase hasn’t degenerated to the level of expectation that many on here have.
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
V
VTCALS72
2y
There is nothing VT can do to improve ourselves in this at this point. VT and really every team in the ACC is being carried along on the floodwater of Big media power.
VT will not "most likely" but they may be in the P2 and the difference is where the flood waters decide to take us.
And the only question is whether big media wants enough teams in the P2 to get to VT.
(In response to this post by Poultrygeist)
2y
I’m a WVU fan. I didn’t say VT wouldn’t end up in P2. All I said was I would selfishly like to have you in the Big 12 (so we would play more). I also said if P2 doesn’t happen that you would likely stay in a reconfigured ACC. If your program was as strong as it was in the Beamer years then you would be a great fit for the SEC. Maybe it still happens?
(In response to this post by Poultrygeist)
V
VPI 1924
2y
VaTech will not end up in the P2.
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
M
Marooned
2y
If CU wasn’t in their existing footprint and competing with USCe, they would already be in. VT is a near peer situation capable of making the playoffs if given the chance. I have to believe that we’re top of mind to them.
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
L
lawhokie
2y
I wonder whether a future ESPN buyer will do something radical in this space. I keep expecting to see an announcement of a sale.
** Edited by lawhokie at 5/7/2024, 7:52:27 PM
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
2y
(In response to this post by lawhokie)
2y
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
Gosh I hope not. Who in that league is an attractive opponent
For VT...outside of WVU
(In response to this post by Maroon Unit)
2y
age, it matters how attractive you are.
I assure you, K-State and Texas Tech fans are not chomping at the bit to play VT. Just this one lone KU fan is.
it's what you bring to the table that matters. If an ACC school can only fill their stadiums when ND and FSU are in town, then maybe they shouldn't be there. From my perspective, it doesn't matter who plays in Blacksburg, your fans will support your team regardless - as it should be.
(In response to this post by VictoryTurkey)
V
VPI 1924
2y
Should definitely join the Big 12 . There will be no invite to SEC or BIG
(In response to this post by Millpoint)
H
Hokie 04
2y
(In response to this post by VPI 1924)
2y
to move on - because without FSU UNC and Clemson - and likely more teams - we don’t want to be left behind - the tv contract will be renegotiated for a lot less I’m afraid. Also, not sure I want to see the new football schedule reminiscent of the ones from the late 70s and early 80s.
(In response to this post by Hokie 04)
V
VTCALS72
2y
Big media is using the XII and paying them a premium at this time. IMHO that premium is because:
1- They know it will take years to get the ACC GOR straightened out and get the 3-4 teams they really want.
2- The PAC totally fooled them by taking the poison pill. That left big media scrambling because there were teams in the PAC that did not go to the Big but that big media has some future place for. So they parked the 4 corners in the XII just like they parked Calford in the ACC.
3- Another reason for the premium is big media has no investment in a network in the XII
4- After the big media/P2 have all they want, I believe big media has a general idea of what a level between G5 and P2 will look like. IMHO that will be a place better than G5 to be training area for future P2 coaches and transfer portal players. But that setup will not have enough $$$ to be as far flung as the XII is without the 4 corners included.
5- There is a good possibility that big media will not invest a dime in producing and mid level or G5 games. They will actually produce P2 content only. It will be up to either individual schools or conferences to produce content from which big media picks which games they want and pays the price to get that game or several games streamed to big media headquarters where their on camera team watches and comments on what is streamed in and then streamed out.
Think about it. The above way big media never has to pay for a BC/Cuse type game. They pick from the menu that the mid level and occasionally G5 has for "sale" that week and take the most attractive.
(In response to this post by Hokie12thman)
2y
But the larger schools will re-org somehow and the smaller schools will keep the ACC (Wake, Duke) name in NC. At that point, JMU might even be invited to join their party to get the DC market!
The bigger schools of the Big 12 and ACC should eventually merge into east / west divisions to make up the P2.75, assuming the SEC only takes UNC and UVA, and the B1G only takes FSU, Clemson.
(Big) East: WVU, Pitt, VT, NC State, GT, Miami, Syracuse, Louisville (barf), Cincinnati, UCF
West: Colorado, Kansas, K-State, Texas Tech, TCU, Utah, Arizona, OK State, SDSU, Iowa State
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
Still haven't received a plausible answer. I can't honestly think of two schools who are less "SEC" than UNC and UVA. I will believe it when I see it.
(In response to this post by Victor Tango)
V
VTCALS72
2y
People talking really don't have the "below the surface" reality of the schools. They see the name without the Tech or State and assume it is the major brand within the state.
There is one other reason and all VT fans just as well own it. UNC on tv will get more clicks nationally than anybody but maybe FSU. If you follow several of the XII or national podcast from XII, Big or western areas, VT is hardly seen as being watched by anybody much east of Roanoke. Hopefully the SEC knows better.
Now the sinister side in me. UNC knows their best football was when they were in the ACC and we were not. There was all this talk about how VT could not be competitive in the ACC and that was UNC driven. They still know they won't be competitive in the P2 if VT is in one as well. I remember a time that UNC was the "home team" for 757 to Richmond and the southside.
The summation, we have shown that on equal footing, year in and year out, we are better in football than UNC and that fact diminished the UNC influence in that section of Virginia. So they want UVA for that and other reasons.
(In response to this post by cvillehokie92)
2y
to succeed at the level needed to compete in SEC football - VT Clemson FSU Miami, NCSU have it - hard to describe what “it” is - but you know it when you see it - having been to multiple SEC and ACC venues - it’s an energy on game day - during good and bad times - been to UVA games for decades - even 90s during welsh years - just not there.
(In response to this post by cvillehokie92)
L
lawhokie
2y
(In response to this post by Hokie12thman)
R
RJHokie
2y
That’s more their flavor/culture.
SEC is definitely a counter-culture for the Hoowahs.
The BIG aligns better with their Olympic Sports though.
(In response to this post by Hokie12thman)
H
Hokie 04
2y
probably impressed the SEC.
That said, UNC fans still have the nerve to act like they're above it all, when in reality they're the worst of the worst.
(In response to this post by cvillehokie92)
E
EDGEMAN
2y
(In response to this post by cvillehokie92)
S
Stech
2y
won't ever make P2 money, but it can make decent money if they do what the B12 did and pull in some higher level G-5's like UConn, USF, San Diego State, Colorado State and maybe a couple of private schools to keep ND, Duke and Wake happy like Tulane and Rice. It will be still be basketball oriented and give ESPN something besides the SEC for basketball. Remember Fox has the B1G, the B12 and the Big East now, so ESPN is going to want some other programming for basketball to match up.
As far as Virginia Tech, I would be ecstatic with either P2, but I would prefer the SEC take Tech, UVA, UNC and NCSU to keep some of the fun that we have had playing them in the ACC, not just in football, but all sports. However, it would be fun to play Penn State, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State too. If the P2 doesn't take Tech, I hope they stay in the ACC, but the B12 would be okay because I do like playing West Virginia every year, I wish we did that no matter the conference we are both in.
** Edited by Stech at 5/7/2024, 1:52:04 PM
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
The old ACC schools have deep ties that are more likely to hold them together for longer than most expect. But any school that is newer (FSU through Stanford) are more of a business partner and not as closely aligned. Some will choose to stay partners because they care more about the academic side. Some will choose to leave because they care about the money and exposure from the athletic side.
Ultimately it depends on what VT cares about. If athletics exposure, success, money are important then we will also leave the ACC at some point. If we want the academic and regional partnerships then we might choose to stay and wait it out. But there is definitely at least one more round of P2 expansion coming within the next 1-5 years.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
I am concerned about Virginia Tech. End of story. And even then, I am less concerned about the circumstances in which Tech ends up and more concerned about getting there soon and moving on with the next phase of life.
The ACC may or may not exist in name in 5 or 10 years, but it won't be the same. It's not the same today as it was in the 1990s. The Big 12 is no longer the Big 12. The Big Ten and SEC are no longer the same either, and the Pac 12 is basically gone.
I predict the SEC and Big Ten will morph into some kind of "NFL Lite" in the next 5 years. A few of those schools may get the boot; a few outsiders may get a ticket inside. The result will be a semi-pro minor league consisting of 32 to 48 schools who are welcome to take their ball and go do their thing.
I predict there will be a second level of 32-48 schools that will be mostly composed of existing ACC and Big 12 schools, with a few others sprinkled in. Let them take their ball and do their own thing, preferably with something akin to "student athletes" participating.
Then, there will be a third level of schools that consist mostly of the rest of the current FBS. Maybe a few schools will drop from FBS to FCS, and a few FCS schools will jump to FBS. The FBS remnants will look a lot like the FCS group, albeit perhaps with a little better funding and following.
My hope is that within each level, there will be some rational reorganization that, particularly among the bottom three groups, will try to return to a more regionalized focus with a planned, organized rotation of more far-flung schools circulating on and off the schedule.
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
I'm perfectly fine for VT to be part of the student athlete group. Yes, there always has been and always will be some bending of rules in place. People get used to ignoring $100 handshakes and "Underwater Basket Weaving" majors, but being shunned because I don't contribute to athletes salaries in the first year of their "professional" career? Nah. Give me students that want to be an athlete at my alma mater because they also want what that brings them - including an education.
I'm not against those other athletes getting paid - go for it - there should be schools like that. Just don't claim the schools that want the student athlete are "using" the athlete. If there are schools paying athletes and you aren't there - you weren't good enough.
** Edited by RTFC at 5/8/2024, 12:20:47 PM
(In response to this post by Tailgate Guru)
Yup. This is about school brands now. Even the "SEC" and "Big Ten" have
lost their identity. They won the money battle, but the entire "conference" era lost the war. And schools within the P2 would be advised to start looking out for number one.
(In response to this post by Tailgate Guru)
V
VTCALS72
2y
phase. I don't think the ACC will be "fine" as we have been defining fine. Neither will compete on a level closer to the P2 than to the G5 but probably closer to the midpoint. Will that be the new fine?
(In response to this post by Bruno)
2y
Not be able to compete with the SEC or Big ten. The ACC will become to the P2 conferences what the AAC was to the p5 conferences a few years ago. It will be a clear two steps behind the P2, but better than the other conferences. And we will be a bit behind the Big 12 as well, after we lose a few schools maybe a clear step behind.
** Edited by wwhokie1 at 5/7/2024, 12:41:54 PM
(In response to this post by Bruno)