UVA/VT an honest assessment
VT - more eyeballs watch games
VT - more students from VA schools which include parents
VT - more alumni
VT - more students graduating to become alumni
VT - new DC area campus
VT - bigger stadium
VT - Expanding student body to what 30,0000-40,000?
UVA - Thomas Jefferson
VT - better football team
UVA - UNC wants them to join them
UVA - more students from PA, MD, NJ, NY
sounds like UVA is nore Big 10
VT more SEC
now who wins UVA wanting Big 10 or UNC's desire for sec. Same money. Both win stadiums that are too small for a P2 conference.
** Edited by LocalExperts at 8/10/2022, 8:47:45 PM
** Edited by LocalExperts at 8/10/2022, 8:48:30 PM
37 Replies
V
Vippie1
3y
have the States tie UVa/VT and UNC/NCSU together respectively, and dont allow the conferences to pick and choose as they see fit.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
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EDGEMAN
3y
From what I've seen, VT fans outnumber UVA fans 3:1 in the Commonwealth...and it isn't close.
Question: if the SEC jumps on UVA with all of their LAX, rowing, and basket weaving championships, will the B1X ignore Virginia and the Commonwealth's largest fan base?
Guess it all hinges on what the P2 are looking for in future members. Does the in-state cable rates take precedence? We've seen that football is driving this bus, so does LAX, rowing, and basket weaving finally take preference? Does the largest fan base in a state take precedence?
The B1X took Nebraska, even though the decision was made to drop them from the AAU before they were admitted. Although they prefer AAU, will they leave the biggest actual VA prize on the table?
If the ACC implodes, I see VA being split. For some odd reason, I don't see the SEC preferring UVA over VT. The only reason the B1X would prefer UVA is that they are current AAU members.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
3y
(In response to this post by EDGEMAN)
13.2% of Virginia Tech's 29,300 undergrads...
are from New Jersey, Maryland, Pennsylvania and New York. Tech may actually have more undergraduates from New Jersey and Maryland than UVA just based on the larger undergraduate enrollment (29,300). I'm sure UVA has more New Yorkers and New Englanders than Tech. UVA had 18,066 undergraduates in 2021-2022, 11,234 less than Tech.
Top 5 Out-of-State Undergraduate Enrollment 2021-2022
New Jersey = 1,406 undergrads or 4.8%
Maryland = 1,113 undergrads or 3.8%
Pennsylvania = 908 undergrads or 3.1%
North Carolina = 674 undergrads or 2.3%
New York = 444 undergrads or 1.5%
** Edited by Old Line Hokie at 8/11/2022, 12:34:01 AM
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
M
Mercury
3y
UNC does not want at any means to be in a conference with VT. They have very explicitly advised to the big 10 and SEC that 1) they be interested HOWEVER, 2) we will not be in a conference with VT as a member and they would go if they bring in UVA........
Its simple as that.... and because for some reason that UNC property value is high its getting traction in media internet world, no matter what the numbers are.....But I dont understand .. UNC is not Texas ND or Oklahoma where they can dictate terms. (like they do in the ACC)
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
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Vippie1
3y
you must have some very well placed sources
(In response to this post by Mercury)
3y
(In response to this post by Vippie1)
2
2hhoop3
3y
you know this? UNC may express a preference for one school(UVA) over another(VT) but, they are in no position to demand a specific partner for a whole host of reasons nor would it benefit them at this stage of the game to even specify.
(In response to this post by Mercury)
3y
(In response to this post by Mercury)
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WarHog38
3y
Does UVA wish to be a dog's tail to North Carolina or dwell in a world of northern intellectual heart-felt superiority? I think the Tar Heels are still more rooted in the south these days. I think UVA is much more now like Maryland which has already flew the ACC coop for the B1G. However will all that overpower any attachment that UVA supposedly has for North Carolina? I think that may be the question that eventually has a big bearing on VT being the choice for the SEC. I think the post here stating that the SEC would like nothing more than barring the door to the B1G in the south is correct. However the SEC cannot control the choice made by UVA. I doubt Maryland would have ever chose the B1G in the first half of the last century. However people crossing state lines for many decades changes the culture of most any place. Has UVA changed enough to balk on the SEC? The B1G will definitely also be courting UVA. I just don't think these conferences are going past 20 teams. I don't seem them as that fool hearty.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
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hokieZ71
3y
I think UNC needs an underling wherever it goes. Like UNC is Saruman and UVA is Grima Wormtongue (If you read Tolkien)
I will say, if they stop at 20, somebody is getting left out.
ND, Stanford, Oregon and Washington to the B1G
Clemson, FSU and 2 out of UNC/Miami/UVA to the SEC. I'd love it if UNC/UVA were such a package deal, the SEC just went with VT and Miami to go with FSU and Clemson.
(In response to this post by WarHog38)
M
Mercury
3y
Putin has nothing on the propaganda out of unc
You are right 1 is left out and vt is in in analytics along with unc..no1 they want vt out- threatens them : then nc state relagate them so uva is a clone school who dont care but good rep. Boom
(In response to this post by hokieZ71)
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WarHog38
3y
I know about North Carolina basketball. However that would leave a slew of tar heel football fans permanently pissed off. Would North Carolina administrators be willing to write them off? That probably would depend on exactly who those administrators happen to be. I think David Boren & Bob Stoops kept Oklahoma out of the SEC with Texas A&M, by demanding the inclusion of Oklahoma State. I know little about those making decisions at UNC. I also do think that the SEC would want a footprint in North Carolina. The SEC would probably take the Wolf Pack. I just don't ever see the SEC taking Miami. The SEC is full of old land grant state universities just like the B1G is full of AAU universities. Miami is a commuter school that is alien to every SEC member.
(In response to this post by hokieZ71)
3y
That is the reason they wanted in the Big East years ago and the reason why they wanted to bring BC and Syracuse with them into the ACC.
There is an old saying in Florida, "the farther south you go, the further north you go".
(In response to this post by WarHog38)
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hokieZ71
3y
USC/UCLA leaving the PAC 12 was so out of left field it probably caught their supporters by surprise. Texas and Oklahoma to the SEC as well.
That veil has been permanently lifted.
UNC’s supporters are going to be well aware of this change and for years ahead of the move. Duke and NCST supporters as well. And everything political in the state of NC will likely exert whatever pressure it can.
(In response to this post by WarHog38)
3y
The B1G wants UNC/UVa because of their academic reputations. They want to use those two to get a foot in the door for a southern branch of The B1G to include Ga Tech for sure, and likely a Florida school. They might be persuaded to include Duke if UNC/UVa insisted.
If The SEC grabs UNC/UVa before The B1G gets them it nullifies The B1G's plan for a southern move. The SEC would then have no necessity to protect the southern monopoly from the B1G. It would give them two new states and two prestigious universities and would save them the expense of procuring other southern properties.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
3y
UVA and UNC were taken by the SEC
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
M
Mercury
3y
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
But I gather lots of data from internet sources and it show UVa with an clear advantage.
(In response to this post by Mercury)
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hokieZ71
3y
They are certainly well ahead of VT in that regard.
But this move has to do with college football matchups and that’s it. Not basketball by the way.
CBS is paying the B1G $350M a year to broadcast 13 football games!!! 1 game per week. They pay the B1G $10M a YEAR for their whole season of basketball. They pay them nothing for their academic reputation.
It all football based and focused on creating as much highly rated content as possible from September through early December. Maryland and Rutgers were about TV markets a decade ago for the Big Ten Network. Now that the money is there it is all about putting the best game on TV each week.
All the research that UVA is capable of doing can’t change that fact.
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
The B1G is still pursuing profitable markets. The SEC insists that the emergence of streaming and the decline of cable TV is the determining calculation. I believe The SEC will grow weary of waiting for the public to fully embrace streaming and completely withdraw from cable. That's going to be long slog.
SEC planners correctly believe that their Southeastern FB brands are far superior to "the rest"; just look at the national championships over recent decades. The B1G crew believes that having a nationwide advertising footprint and equally broad fanbase will be the better path. The B1G has also inoculated themselves from cable anemia by choosing to sell their goods on OTA networks, three of them.
As for basketball, most of the revenue comes from March Madness and 2/3 of the revenue is retained by The NCAA and only 1/3 distributed to the schools. The outsized popularity of that tournament also has the effect of making the regular season irrelevant. That contract with The NCAA runs through 2032. I think the major conferences will be gone from The NCAA before that date arrives. They might (just my opinion) delay the basketball season so that it does not overlap so much of the football season. The tournament will be less grand but still wildly profitable. And the regular season will be rediscovered and better monetized.
And, yes, I think academics (AAU in particular) will cause a certain amount of exclusion from The B1G. ND and an unnamed Florida school being the exceptions.
(In response to this post by hokieZ71)
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hokieZ71
3y
I don’t see any East coast additions before those happen. ND, Seattle, Bay Area, Portland and the Oregon brand, and filling out the Pacific Coast are next.
So if the B1G does go east coast, this discussion is moot because both P2 conferences end up going past 20 and VT and UVA are likely both going to get selected at that point
If the B1G stays at 20, UNC is going to end up having to pick between UVA and the SEC because Miami, FSU and Clemson will be above UNC at that point. I don’t see UNC wanting to stick with UVA in the Big XII or basketball-centric ACC.
In a way I could see the SEC and B1G fighting over the South Eastern Atlantic properties remaining and in a way I can see them stopping at 20 and ending it.
The same way Virginia doesn’t have a pro team might end up manifesting itself in this new Power 2 model (MD is already in the B1G if you’re screaming about Washington/Baltimore Pro teams, which are not located in VA, no matter your thoughts on the Commanders)
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
Haven't they had a big head start. Hasn't VT cut that gap tremendously since BIG East entry?
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
The goal would be to keep expanding in 2’s. And you pick them using a combination of geography, brand, size, football quality, basketball quality, and general fit. My spitball guess at the top pairs under consideration are:
ND and Kansas
UNC and UVA
Oregon and Washington
Cal and Stanford
I don’t see any need for the BIG to over stretch both west and south. There is no need for them to go below North Carolina. They have 8 teams who could all provide some value. Plus 4 more and easily available if they wanted to really grow and grab more schools (Utah, Colorado, Iowa St, OK State).
The BIG has plenty of options to choose from.
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
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hokieZ71
3y
They just went straight to LA and got USC and UCLA.
If the B1G wants a Florida school they'll go get a Florida school first.
The SEC and B1G are going to fight over FSU/Miami/Clemson and UNC and UVA will be next in line.
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
(In response to this post by hokieZ71)
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hokieZ71
3y
Notre Dame, definitely.
Cal too, as a backup.
Wake and UNC honestly kind of a toss up if Duke gets taken first and you need that NC market.
I don't even know if there's room left for UVA at that point. NC is growing far faster than VA. I'd lock up the NC/Cal market and then go to, maybe Georgia? ATL, go get GT, fine academic school.
So, yeah, if the B1G is going for academic domination and big market states, maybe ND, Stanford, Duke, GT. That's gonna look good to Fox, NBC and CBS to shell out another almost half billion or so to watch those debates.
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
the SEC when the Big 10 also wants them. That is the question.
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
The only way out of the ACC media deal before 2036 is a mass jailbreak by enough ACC members to blow up the conference. If ESPN wants the southern monopoly bad enough it will spend whatever it takes to keep them from The B1G. The B1G, however would not (in my opinion, of course) be willing to take-on a large group of ACC renegades. They really only need four to achieve what they want. So that is the scenario for UNC/UVa to The SEC, an ESPN funded jailbreak.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
3y
offers same amount of money. less competition.
(In response to this post by 33laszlo99)
3y
If they decide to join The B1G it will be for academic reasons. All but one of the B1G schools are members of The AAU, as are UNC, UVa, Duke, and Georgia Tech. They emphasize research and spend ungodly amounts of money on it. Far more than the petty cash involved in sports. They are academic snobs and they like it that way. Read some UNC boards and Michigan boards and try to decide which are the most uppity and self aggrandizing jackasses. Also The B1G pays waaay better.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
3y
UVA bigger brand
Look, we may hate it but reality is that uva has more appeal than vt
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)
3y
where is your data. I am going to bet VT football gets bigger ratings.
** Edited by LocalExperts at 8/10/2022, 8:51:39 PM
(In response to this post by 133193Hokie)
3y
live content to fill the slots? If so, then football ratings may not matter as much if the other programs don't carry their fair share of the weight. At least School A's overall athletic program rating may be higher than School B's rating in football.
(In response to this post by LocalExperts)