Pry killing our realignment prospects.
I've said this a few times on here in the past, but there is more on the line than winning in this 5 year window that is the Pry Era.
Fair or unfair, that's the way it is. I'm not sure if Pry knows or cares about it, but the administration better know and care.
Getting upset by a P2 bottom feeder in the opener is devastating.
Zero national attention from here on out unless we knock someone off of national prominence. Perhaps an undefeated U on Sept. 27. And that depends on the U being undefeated. Either way, it's a crappy way to live even before Week 2 is here. And the U game is on Friday night (LOL) when high schools play. We are already in a lousy, uninspiring conference.
The further we get from the height of the Beamer era, the more we will be an afterthought in realignment.
** Edited by Maroon Baboon at 9/1/2024, 10:37:26 AM
57 Replies
Won't have a thing in the world to do with it
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
1y
(by far) worst team. Hard to stay interested after a start like this, especially after all the hype, the fallacy that the players have all bought in, and all the other noise.
Pathetic coaching in prep for this game/season
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
They won't be the worst team this year
(In response to this post by MDHokie79)
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WarHog38
1y
However Vandy does not play either Florida or Mississippi State this season. I think Kentucky will beat Vandy. The story should be told on Arkansas this coming Saturday in Stillwater. Arkansas should beat Oklahoma State just like good Arkansas teams did each year for decades years ago. Those game. were nearly always in Little Rock but the Cowboys got a yearly butt kicking. Arkansas should still beat them if worth any salt as an SEC team. Arkansas loses to Okie Lite. Then Arkansas would probably not beat Vandy if they played each other. A loss to Okie Lite would probably be the final nail in Pittman's coffin. I want the Hogs to win but losing Pittman is a good thing to me.
(In response to this post by MDHokie79)
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Marooned
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Yeah, they may be doormats again, but in large measure it will be because they saw how the new players were being used against us. They could also vault up; then the L won’t look quite as horrific.
(In response to this post by MDHokie79)
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WarHog38
1y
I remember how the Longhorns most every season dominated the lines of scrimmage against the Razorbacks. The All Texan SWC officiating was real bad but the Longhorns would push the Razorback players on the lines of scrimmage. You could see it. That is why the series was lopsided favoring the Longhorns. That triple option Wishbone Offense the Longhorns ran meant controlling the O-Line to function. They use to call it Three Yards and a Cloud of Dust.
However you look at the games Arkansas has played against Texas since entering the SEC. The percentage that Arkansas wins against Texas has went way up from SWC days. Texas no longer controls those lines of scrimmage. Arkansas has had wins against Texas while in the SEC where they mopped the floor with Texas. I know entering the SEC is going to help Texas condition their lineman into beasts. Texas will get tougher. The same would go for Virginia Tech. The SEC would make Virginia Tech tougher. Anybody that has watched college football for years knows that.
** Edited by WarHog38 at 9/1/2024, 4:43:27 PM
(In response to this post by MDHokie79)
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drb
1y
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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TDVick
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(In response to this post by drb)
Here’s a PATT take
Espn will root for us to win the ACC now, so that they can say, “ The ACC champ couldn’t beat Vandy”
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
1y
He created the negative momentum that Pry and his staff seem unable to reverse. It was clear that Fuente had to go early in his 3rd year and we rode him for two more seasons (or was it 3?).
I do believe that this was the year we absolutely had to have, and it is clear Pry et al have dropped the ball.
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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Stech
1y
FSU last year. I do understand the anger, but that’s one game, don’t send up the surrender flag quite yet.
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
1y
then Auburn and UK, though both of those are on the road. Mizzou, Bama, Tennessee, Texas, and LSU are all losses. Bad losses. Their best play is the QB scramble. That won’t fly in the SEC.
(In response to this post by Stech)
1y
But they really didn’t do anything extraordinary. VT was awful. Pavia is not getting 100 yards running against any of their SEC opponents.
** Edited by reestuart at 9/1/2024, 6:35:10 PM
** Edited by reestuart at 9/1/2024, 6:35:42 PM
(In response to this post by Stech)
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Stech
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could go either way. However, I think they are a lot better than people thought with this portal team. People IMHO need to let go of the past with the portal and NIL. It’s a different universe now.
(In response to this post by reestuart)
1y
The "bottom feeders" of the P2 have, are, and will even more so in the future, making a crap ton more money than the ACC and BigXII teams. The current trajectory, the money gap will be huge. So beating Vandy, Indiana, et. al. won't be as easy as it used to be.
** Edited by Maroon Baboon at 9/1/2024, 10:39:18 AM
(In response to this post by Stech)
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Stech
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names on the jerseys don’t matter like they used to with the Portal and NIL. Just look how many of our key players are portal players, and look at Clemson fighting the Portal.
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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and that somehow we shouldn't be talking about on-field results on the CR board. They don't get it. They don't understand the severity of the loss in the context of the bigger picture.
This is about looking like we belong in the P2 in everything we do. Winning. Attendance. Academics (for the B1G at least). TV ratings. Passion.
Our TV numbers aren't great. Not because we don't have our own fans supporting us, but that losing one week, leads to crappier time slots and channels the next. Get ready to be on the ACCN (or worse) for a while, instead of on ESPN or ABC.
(In response to this post by MDHokie79)
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WarHog38
1y
My father was a bigger supporter of Razorback football than I have ever dreamed about achieving. Got personal letters from Frank Broyles. He went to home & away games all over Texas. Had a suitcase with all the insignias of the SWC schools stuck upon it. I was amazed looking at that suitcase with mustangs, frogs, bears & horned cattle as a 3 & 4 year old while I rummaged the house. My father gave yearly big checks to the Razorback Foundation and was heavily involved as a older man in the controlling the parking and the crowds during games at the home stadiums in Little Rock & Fayetteville. By the time I was 8 or 9 years old, I was going with my father to Little Rock Razorback games and was living & dying when the Hogs won or lost. I would have a dozen questions for my father when my beloved Hogs lost. My father always had one pat answer. "Boy, It Was The Coaching."
Virginia Tech has a veteran team, returned more contributing players off last year's roster than any other P4 program in the country. Virginia Tech should have dispatched Vanderbilt with those credentials. Why not? It Was The Coaching.
Is Tech's season lost by losing to Vandy? No. However the Tech coaches have got to go to work coaching the team. Their capability to do so is the only real question for the future.
** Edited by WarHog38 at 9/1/2024, 6:59:53 PM
** Edited by WarHog38 at 9/1/2024, 7:03:42 PM
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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cjpayne8
1y
a win or two. Season isn’t over by a long shot, and yes there is a lot to learn from AND be disappointed by in this loss. But we just have to move on to Marshall
(In response to this post by Stech)
1y
Out of the gates. It is now clear that there is something fundamentally wrong with Pry and his staff. VT will not bounce back from this because the deadwood is the staff, not the players.
(In response to this post by Stech)
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Stech
1y
you finish.
(In response to this post by VT ChemE 1986)
1y
poor for the entire first half. No adjustments whatsoever until halftime, lackluster play for first 2 quarters, and a stupid, stupid, stupid special teams gaffe that cost 3 points ... and thus the game. I give you that Vandy is likely better than advertised, but VT lost that game due to bad play and bad coaching.
(In response to this post by Stech)
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Stech
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throwing. We did better the second half, but still too much horizontal plays in my opinion. Just use the Tulane game plan, get going vertically. If they are crowding the LOS, beat them over the top like they finally did with Ali Jennings.
(In response to this post by HokieToph)
1y
And if that's the case, there ain't no P2 invite coming.
(In response to this post by HokieToph)
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Marooned
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LOL
One year does not make or break us. It’s more about how committed we are to succeeding. What does that look like both from a departmental standpoint and a fan standpoint?
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
1y
score appeared. And it doesn't look like we got any better from last year. Not sure how Rutgers is this year. Probably not worse.
Here's the deal with teams like Rutgers and Vandy. They are P2 bottom feeders. But they are making 40 or 50 million dollars more a year than anyone of the non-P2 for regular season TV. And this doesn't include the incoming CFP money, which will be huge for the B1G and SEC when they (and ND) get nearly all of the 7 at-large bids.
And while it may not have been this way five years ago, modern recruits and transfers will start preferring a bottom P2 school, to a mid-level ACC school like VT.
** Edited by Maroon Baboon at 9/1/2024, 3:46:43 PM
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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Marooned
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Maybe when the B1G starts overwhelming the SEC and stealing their bell cow programs, who knows. If they could break up Bell Telephone for monopolistic reasons, then the wreckage of college athletics by the top conference(s), coupled with their media partners justifies similar treatment.
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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utilities) to exist for the good of public interest.
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Marooned
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Damaging state economies, limiting options for athletes to compete at the highest level. It’s quite detrimental actually.
(In response to this post by VTHokie2000)
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First, Congress may not be able to come up with a solution to address all/most of the issues involved here. Second, even if Congress does decide to act, it cannot force schools to remain in the NCAA. Remember the NCAA isn't the only intercollegiate athletic association for 4-year schools. If the NAIA exists, then there is nothing to prevent the schools from creating a third intercollegiate athletic association. If the P2s and whatever other schools opt to form their own association or even their own division level within the NCAA, then they are still "limiting options for athletes to compete at the highest level" because not every school will not be allowed to participate.
If you think about it, then you will realize the phrase "compete at the highest level" was born as a marketing phrase to help the networks promote their broadcasts. It may be a fallacy to view collegiate athletics the same way people view professional baseball with a tier system. Instead, college athletics may need to be viewed similar to HS athletics where each division is independent of each other. Just because VHSL has 6 divisions, it doesn't automatically make 6A the "highest level." For some regions of the commonwealth the "highest level" is A, AA, AAA, or even 4A.
Given there is a wide range in budgets among the schools and varying costs associated with each NCAA division, it may be time to conclude the 3 NCAA divisions is an outdated concept. Instead, it may be time for the NCAA to increase the number of NCAA divisions to 4, 5, or 6 so the members of each group have more things in common than they do now. Also, it may be time either eliminate movement between NCAA divisions (notice I didn't include the word "level") or substantly increase the difficulty to move between NCAA divisions. It isn't good to have schools make the move to DI because they are chasing after the money when they may not be in the position to handle the cost associated with the move. Also, it may be time to eliminate the subdivisions for DI football. Regardless whether the NCAA called the subdivisions DI-A/DI-AA or DI-FBS/DI-FCS, people ignorantly called the DI-AA/DI-FCS subdivision "DII" for some odd reason even though DII already existed as a separate NCAA division.
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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Marooned
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I’m addressing the monopolistic influences of the P2 as created by their broadcast partners searching for an optimal return on their investments. The networks need to be viewed for what they are - the lifeblood of intercollegiate athletics. Intercollegiate athletics needs to be viewed for what it is, which is far more than what it was originally intended to be (I.e., a source of school pride, an opportunity to extend scholarships to deserving athletes, and a venue for showcasing athletic skills). The revenue sports have become a huge publicity push for colleges and universities to attract new students, a cash cow for networks, athletic departments, college towns, bowl destinations and the travel industry, and a windfall for enterprising athletes who now have multiple schools competing for their talents. It is a business. It is BIG business. What is going on now can only be characterized as predatory business practices. The damages are real, some are readily calculable. Just because schools have the ability to leave the NCAA doesn’t change that fact.
(In response to this post by VTHokie2000)
1y
believe the demand for non-P2 content isn't there to justify the cost, then Congress cannot force them to increase the broadcast of non-P2 content. Plus, the broadcast availability now includes both linear and streaming options which will only undermine the argument that the P2s have a monopoly. Now if Congress is willing to subsides the cost, then the networks may be willing to listen. Guess who will end up paying for that subsidy?
You probably will find some politicians who say they agree with your position. However, I would be very surprised if any piece of legislation close to what you are proposing is able to make its way out of a committee. Unfortunately, I do not think this is one of those issues that will end up being the hill they want to die on.
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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Marooned
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I’m missing your point. The current environment is predatory. That’s pretty apparent. The government has already injected itself in similar circumstances.
(In response to this post by VTHokie2000)
1y
sporting events if demand isn't there to support it simply because some people believe the P2s now have a monopoly over the networks. If Congress does try to go down this rabbit hole, then all the P2s have to do is breakaway from the NCAA and form their own association. Heck even become a pro organization if neccessary. It would kill the argue because you are trying to compare college sports to pro sports. Plus, if this was truly a big deal, then Congress would have already done something about the "monopoly" NCAA DI broadcasts have over NCAA DII, NCAA DIII, NAIA DI, NAIA DII, and even JUCO broadcasts. If you are going to complain about the "monopoly" the P2 now, then you should be prepared to potentially give up DI broadcasts to make room for an increase in the broadcasts currently excluded from the current TV deals.
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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TDVick
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advantage. They had a terrible QB.
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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RU will pancake our lines. Book it.
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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The momentum impact of this loss is devastating.
(In response to this post by Marooned)
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Marooned
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and we would deserve to be relegated if we did. That hasn’t been the case at VT.
We’re the ultimate owners of the program.
(In response to this post by VT ChemE 1986)
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WarHog38
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It is the Head coach. Arkansas has had a lot of bad coaches. I have closely observed all three. Bielema & Pittman were & are basically just stupid on the X's & O's that constitute good football. The technical blocking schemes by lineman & coverage schemes by DB's LB's that must be executed on both sides of the line of scrimmage. A good head coach must instantly notice failed assignments by players on offense & defense in game films and call those players out to be corrected. The players must respect the head coach as only wishing their betterment. All that is required of a good head football coach. They were both just stupid. Morris was a fruitcake that should have never advanced past the Texas high schools. How Debo Sweeney helped produce Morris is beyond me. Head coaches can depend on smart & experienced assistants to some extent but they must be very special assistants for them to carry much of the load.
The saddest post I read here is the one that said Pry cannot be replaced in the short term. Virginia Tech does need to get better fast.
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
1y
ill-advised extension. So it might as well have been three straight. I wanted Tech to promote Bud Foster when Beamer retired. I thought he rated it.
I didn't like the Fuente hire but loved the Pry hire. I thought he'd be a Bud Foster like coach. Looks like I might be wrong on that one. No one knows where the program would be if we hired Foster back in 2016, but I would have liked to have found out.
(In response to this post by WarHog38)
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Stech
1y
might want to come to such harsh conclusions so fast. The Vandy QB if he stays healthy, is going to upset more than one team IMHO.
(In response to this post by WarHog38)
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WarHog38
1y
A loss in Fayetteville in 2018. That was with Chad Morris as head coach, Morris did not win one SEC game in his two years at Arkansas.Those Morris teams would have made the Hokies look great today playing a SEC foe.
To answer your question, Vandy is not on Arkansas' schedule in 2024 or 2025. I don't know about in the future after that . However Arkansas has only played Vandy seven times in 33 years in the SEC if you count up to 2025. Arkansas is 7-3 overall against Vandy but 5-2 while SEC. Check how many times the Big Six (Alabama, Auburn, LSU, Georgia, Tennessee & Florida) in the SEC have played against Vandy over that time span?
I know Arkansas & Texas A&M hit the Transfer Portal the hardest in the SEC in both losses & gains. Wasn't aware Vandy made a killing in the portal. Vandy has not challenged as a contender in the SEC in the 31 years that Arkansas has been in the SEC. However anything is possible. A good SEC showing by Vandy would surely now help the Hokies.
(In response to this post by Stech)
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Stech
1y
good. Still with Tech having about 10 unforced errors, we were one play from winning. It was a really bad day for us, but that was far from a typical Vandy team. IMHO they will win some SEC games. Now we see how it goes for them, but we have to be much better focused. Hopefully this is a wake up call for Tech. Lots of football to be played.
(In response to this post by WarHog38)
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WarHog38
1y
Unless a fan base is hell bent on a natty as it was at Alabama after a few years with Saban. I looked ahead at Virginia Tech's future schedule.
I think the next three games are the keys to a possibly real good season for Virginia Tech, Marshall, Old Dominion & Rutgers. Those next three games surely will now make or break the Tech football season more than the Vandy game. Going to Miami at 3-1 would give Tech a clear avenue to a real good season by winning at Miami.
(In response to this post by Stech)
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VPI_1998
1y
NOT GOOD. All the experience and - dare I say - talent coming back (we saw it in the 3rd qtr and halfway thru the 4th) and a series of bonehead mistakes cost the game. Some will say it's just 1 game - but it's not. This is the critical year 3 for a coach and staff, an opening season road test, and they failed miserably today.
We saw it a handful of times last year but Drones and co. overcame it against Syracuse, Wake Forest, BC, and UVA. But against teams with a pulse, nada.
Could everyone have been wrong and this group really is not as talented, experienced, and deep as we were told and Pry and Co have been coaching them up? I really, really don't think so..
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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VPI 1924
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If our players are better than good, they would be playing somewhere else.
(In response to this post by VPI_1998)
1y
He is a nice, Hokie administrator with no real talent for coaching and hiring and leading his own staff.
The good news is he appears to get on well with the players, administration and fans. That alone will keep him around through the end of his contract.
Expect us to hover around 0.500 throughout that period.
(In response to this post by Maroon Baboon)
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TDVick
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(In response to this post by VT ChemE 1986)