they have supposedly convinced the SEC Presidents too, which is why all the rumors are UNC and UVA are their top SEC candidates for expansion. Maybe the P2 plans to break off and do their own 🏀 tournament, and they want traditional basketball schools to help ratings with that tournament. PS I don’t like this, and if it happens I will encourage every school’s fan left out, not to watch it. ** Edited by Stech at 3/28/2025, 10:25:46 PM

Likely being manipulated by their former boss John Skipper for his own personal agenda.

Each comes from a wishful outcome point of view. but IMHO Flugar got one thing right with his "the biggest domino falls first." The biggest domino is ND but they are not in the game. The next biggest is UNC plain and simple. I hate it but IIWII. They are the larger public school with a national brand in a non P2 area. I have no doubt they are angling for UVA. I know UNC thinks they have the power to dictate because they have run the ACC for years. The real reason they want UVA is that ties in Virginia which has a mega population center. Simple put with UVA, the state of VA gets in the area with no real threat to UNC then owning the NC/VA area. They don't want teams who could really challenge them for supremacy in viewers, fans etc. They do not want to have to compete with NCSU and VT because they know if those 2 have a level playing field, UNCs supremacy prospect fall a lot.

Assuming you're making a comparison to VT, UNC is not "the larger public school." VT has an enrollment of well over 1000 more students. Both schools are dwarfed by 15-20k+ in enrollment by the large Big 10 publics. You're way out in left field with your ND take. ND is very much in the game, even if not to become an official full member of a conference. ND will very soon easily be able to leave its ACC commitments, just as Clemson and FSU will be. You're delusional if you don't think either or both of the SEC or the Big 10 would chomp at the bit to enter football scheduling agreements similar or even bigger than the one ND currently has with the ACC, both of which would be much more lucrative for ND, and literally any conference would let ND park the rest of their sports. UNC is a "national brand" in basketball. That's the draw with UNC. Asian tourists wear UNC stuff because they know about Michael Jordan. Michael Jordan, and the Duke-UNC basketball games. That's the entire UNC brand, lock, stock, and barrel. If a conference wants UNC, they know that's what they're buying. Literally nobody cares about UNC football, not even the people in the athletic department at UNC. It's like a side project for them. UNC will never "own" the major population centers in Virginia in terms of fan draw. If anything, those major population centers, which outside of the Richmond metro are largely made up of transplants from outside the state working for the fed or the military, skew towards many different out-of-state programs, most prominently Penn State, Michigan, and other Big 10 schools, but in terms of in-state, there's zero doubt whatsoever that VT drives the bus when it comes to college football. NCSU, while it has a larger enrollment than UNC and VT, and a perennial journeyman football program, will never be a threat to UNC or anyone else, because NCSU is also a basketball school with about 5x less pedigree and fans. College sports in the state of North Carolina, like the state of Indiana, is 100% pure basketball. Football is an afterthought for the alumni and fans of the "elite" North Carolina schools.

wrt the "large public school thing. Right now it is that UNC is a national brand and is wanted and VT are neither. I made a bad assumption that everyone should know there are only 2 national brands in the VA/NC area, UNC and Duke. Compared to Duke UNC is the larger public institution. And I do believe the name in the brand is not limited to any one sport. National viewers, IMHO will stop and watch a name they know. Only a few will actually do the research or find some of the things you are pointing out. Most national viewers will see the name they know and that is that. It does not matter if they are watching UGA Bball and rooting/watching them because it is the nationally known UGA. Similarly people will watch Duke and UNC football because it is a name they know. IMHO that is what big media is banking on in throwing away probably 100 schools in D1 football. Next, I grew up in the Richmond area and I can tell you that UNC was considered by many. including the RTD writers as the elite school in the region especially when Bill Dooley was their coach and half their successful teams were Virginians. UNC got the leading stories. And look at the map, Chapel Hill is 54 miles closer to Richmond, 117 miles closer to Norfolk. There are situations mileage doesn't matter as much in this day in time but when the end product is fewer teams at the highest level and how big media can get the most market with the fewest teams, national brand in any revenue sport matters.

Not sure, maybe I'm delusional too...ND would instantly be top view/top pay-out in ACC and would likely get same or higher media than P2. The ACC did them a good-will fav bringing-in Stanford(?). ND kinda grudge-hates B1G (although Geo makes sense) and I'm not sure they "fit" nor fanbase wants to be in the SEC. 2028-29 is gonna be interesting

Hiroshima was kind of an explosion. ND fans despise the Big Ten. There are a number of reasons that ND is not a long time Big Ten member. That is a big one of them The only thing in common with the Big Ten is geography. It is a small, private, Catholic school. The Big Ten is mostly large, public schools. ND football is the square peg in a round hole for any conference. It is not a fit for any of them.

That is, of course, if the ACC football schools get picked apart by the SEC, B1G and B12 and their media partners. Probably less of a football commitment (maybe 3-4 games, or no commitment at all) which could free ND up somewhat to schedule as they please moving forward.

In fact, I am almost 100% certain that had it had been clear at the time what was going to happen with the Catholic 7 splitting from the schools that would become the American, with the Catholic 7 keeping the Big East name, branding, record books, etc., Notre Dame would never have made the deal it made with the ACC to park its non-football sports there. Notre Dame would MUCH rather be sending its basketball and non-rev sports into major metro population areas to play other similar sized Catholic institutions right now, while retaining its full football scheduling autonomy. At the time, however, circa-2011, the Big East was clearly going to bifurcate, the Catholic schools were the ones threatening to "leave," and the latter day USF-type additions to the Big East looked to be driving the bus. Notre Dame wasn't going to caught dead having their non-football sports play "Big East" conference games against ECU and UAB. So, the ACC deal was cut instead.

It's more or less a public relations arm of the Roman Catholic church. TV money largely means jack squat to ND. If it did, they'd be in a conference yesterday. ** Edited by Baltimore_Hokie at 3/28/2025, 3:24:45 PM ** Edited by Baltimore_Hokie at 3/28/2025, 3:25:27 PM

conference - any conference. Especially the ACC. It's like they dismiss history because the Big 10 imploded the PAC.

The P2 at 20 each with 4 divisions of 5 in football, with each division champ in football getting a playoff bid, makes a ton of sense. (Next 2 best records get "wild card" bids in each conference, making 6 for SEC and 6 for B1G) The way the conferences are built, the SEC needs some wins for it's major teams, while the B1G needs East Coast powers to match with Penn State in an Atlantic Division. FSU easily fits the B1G and then Miami probably matches best as well from a major brand and major TV market pro model. Having an Atlantic division of Penn State, FSU, Miami, Maryland and Rutgers works with the three heavyweights up top. Moving to the SEC - which at 16 would need to add 4 - UNC and UVA added to an eastern division with Florida, Georgia and South Carolina makes a lot of sense. UGA and Florida get the benefit of some potentially easy paths to the playoffs once uneven revenue distribution in the P2 kicks in. But the SEC needs to add 2 out West as well. Kansas makes most sense, as fodder for Texas, OU and aTm, and then either Arizona or Oklahoma State. I think Arizona looks better here, with a high level basketball program, and the AAU status of the university. Sorry Clemson, but you get to take a lot of money in the ACC's uneven distribution. So, you get: SEC East: UGA, Florida, South Carolina, UNC, UVA SEC Bama: Bama, Auburn, Tennessee, Vandy, Kentucky SEC Bayou: LSU, Ole Miss, Miss St, Arkansas, Missouri SEC Texas: Texas, aTm, OU, Kansas, Arizona B1G East: Penn State, FSU, Miami, Maryland, Rutgers B1G Beast: Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, Indiana, Purdue B1G Least: Wisconsin, Illinois, Minnesota, Iowa, Northwestern B1G PAC: USC, UCLA, Oregon, Washington, Nebraska 9 conference games in the P2, you always play your division, and rotate between the other 3 every two years, so you have a true round robin to determine playoff spots. The P2 will play one game against the other P2, and then a G5 or rivalry game, and virtually never play against the top teams in the ACC or Big XII. By the way, 20 conference teams makes for an incredible opportunity to split into 10 team hoops divisions and have a double round robin 18 game schedule.

I bet that is where at least UVA would prefer to go from an Academic point of view. It will be interesting if the two states allow UVA and UNC to go without a P2 landing spot for VT and NC ST. If the conferences would go to 24 instead of 20 in your scenario then there are landing spots for many other schools. I can't imagine Clemson would get left out but stranger things have happened I guess. Not totally sold on SEC going after Kansas and Arizona either. The following could possibly happen: Big Ten to 22: UVA, UNC, FSU, Miami SEC to 20: Clemson, VT, NC ST, Kansas What happens to Duke and GT? Would Big Ten or SEC want either?

I wonder if the SEC, B1G, and the state governments of VA and NC as well as the schools.

Everyone knows nationally that UVA and VT are joined at the hip, at all levels of state government and its bi partisan. My putting that 'false narrative' out the parties are trying to break the virginia tie.

They have been associated with them for many years. WVU used to be as much a game as Uva. Until BS took it away.

I’d agree they’re not “joined at the hip” that’s hyperbole, but UVA does care about UNC from a rivalry point of view, I can assure you.

I listened to the episode as well. It was a cross between the self-evident and the clueless. 1. He talked about them being "tied at the hip" but used as evidence that the two schools "coordinate" on everything. Talked about academic connections, etc. But the things he mentioned don't even require schools to be in the same conference. There seemed to be no evidence that they actually said to each other "we are leaving and going to the same conference." 2. He also left out any discussion of VT or NC State. Now I think in the end, if only one school per state has a P2 invite, I don't think the other in-state school will hold them back. But I don't know this for sure, and certainly Flugaur doesn't either. I think him and many of the CR hustlers think they can almost speak this stuff into existence. The in-state politics stuff matters, even if they won't stop it in the end. 3. Lastly, he was acting surprised by what he was reporting. But for anyone who even has a rudimentary knowledge of the ACC knows that UNC and UVa have the (Co-) Oldest Rivalry in the South and they view each other as peer institutions--Public Ivies if you will. That being said, none of this means they will be in the same conference. I will say this about UVa--they think they are a superior school to UNC and they will likely make their OWN decision in the end an what's best for them, regardless of what Chapel Hill thinks. ** Edited by Maroon Baboon at 3/27/2025, 11:28:03 PM