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jdkhokie OP
Aug 08, 2024 at 01:32 PM ET
Looks like Salm's Rule is indicating a recession is coming. I have my
doubts because the the nation has been flooded with illegals taking jobs so while the unemployment rate has gone up .5 percent from the 12 month low there is heavy demand for food, vehicles, housing etc. that would be declining under normal conditions and causing the layoffs. The layoffs could be more a substitution for cheaper labor. What is the Lounge experts opinion? From Wikiland Historical Accuracy The Sahm rule is a robust tool that has been very accurate in identifying a downturn in the business cycle and almost always doesn't trigger outside of a recession. The simplicity of the calculation contributes to its reliability. The Sahm rule signals the early stages (onset) of a recession and generated only two false positive recession alerts since the year 1959 (there have been 11 recessions since 1950); in both instances — in 1959 and 1969 — it was just a little untimely, with the recession warning appearing a few months before a slide in the U.S. economy began.[15] In the case of the false positive warning related to the year 1959 it was followed by an actual recession six months later. The Sahm rule typically signals a recession before GDP data makes it clear.[16] The Sahm rule is designed to indicate that the U.S. economy is in the early months of a recession, rather than forecasting future recessions.[17] While the historical performance and timeliness of the Sahm rule has been very accurate, the reliability of the Sahm rule in today's economy has been questioned by many economists (including Claudia Sahm) due to several distortions and there is reason to believe that the economy might act differently this time around due to unique unusual conditions.[18][19][20][21]This suggests that caution should be exercised when interpreting the Sahm rule in the current unprecedented economic situation. Like all economic indicators, it should be considered alongside other economic data and indicators. However, the Sahm Rule remains a valuable tool for economists and policymakers for early detection of economic downturns. Table: Historical accuracy of the Sahm rule; Alert coincides with recession: (U.S. unemployment rate, dates when the Sahm rule triggered & actual recession time)[22] Unemployment rate % Sahm value Time when Sahm > 0.5 Recession starts... 3.50% 0.63 Nov 1953 4 months prior (Jul 1953) 4.50% 0.50 Oct 1957 2 months prior (Aug 1957) 5.80% 0.60 Nov 1959 5 months later (Apr 1960) 4.40% 0.77 Mar 1970 3 months prior (Dec 1969) 5.50% 0.60 Jul 1974 8 months prior (Nov 1973) 6.30% 0.53 Feb 1980 1 month prior (Jan 1980) 8.30% 0.60 Nov 1981 4 months prior (Jul 1981) 5.90% 0.53 Oct 1990 3 months prior (Jul 1990) 4.50% 0.50 Jun 2001 3 months prior (Mar 2001) 4.90% 0.53 Feb 2008 2 months prior (Dec 2007) 14.80% 4.00 Apr 2020 2 months prior (Feb 2020) 4.30% 0.53 Aug 2024 - In summary, the Sahm rule's reliability lies in its consistent performance throughout various economic climates, particularly in signaling the beginning of a recession with a high degree of accuracy. ** Edited by jdkhokie at 8/8/2024, 1:34:05 PM

16 Replies

UTPr0sim UTPr0sim
"Flooded with illegals taking jobs" Dare I say there is no data on this
There is a network that has been convicted of telling lies, spreading this one. If you want a job in the USA you can have one with the unemployment rate where it is. Ask any unemployment agency. Now if you don't want to work....
SDHokie SDHokie
I was going to pick lettuce in the Imperial Valley in 115 degree heat but
an illegal took my job.
V
Va AandM
Claudia Sahm feels it’s a false signal so…
WestyHokie WestyHokie
Given there has been 14 recessions since 1950, not 11, I question this
Official recessions, as defined by nonpartisan economists*. If "data" is used to define desired findings, then it doesn't say anything. *National Bureau of Economic Research. "U.S. Business Cycle Expansions and Contractions." https://www.nber.org/research/data/us-business-cycle-expa... ** Edited by WestyHokie at 8/8/2024, 6:06:46 PM
Hokebury Hokebury
Actually the number of "illegals" in the US has been extremely stable over
the last 20 years. Its actually slightly down with a high around 2006.
J
jdkhokie OP
I was referring to the 12.6 million that illegally crossed the border in
the last 4 years without authorization or documentation thus making it illegal under US immigration law but I think you already knew what I meant. The question however is whether they would be a reason to consider the Salm's rule invalid. ** Edited by jdkhokie at 8/8/2024, 4:21:54 PM
Hokebury Hokebury
I think the number is much lower and therefore probably has very little
effect. Actually since 2019 there have been approx. 7.2 million attempted crossings. That number includes those caught and returned and those turned away at the border. So we are probably talking between 3-4 million in all that successfully crossed into the US.
E
EDGEMAN
It was actually more than that, but our government is hiding the official #
RoswellGAHokie RoswellGAHokie
Why put quotes around illegals?
Hokebury Hokebury
That is the term he used. Call them whatever you want...
Stork Stork
Well, then who do we blame?
UEMcGill UEMcGill
I just wish we'd go ahead and have a recession, if for no other reason than
to stop the endless speculation about one. How long have we been looking for one? Two, three years? Hell, the average American wouldn't know if we were in one if they weren't told we're in one.
WestyHokie WestyHokie
The real story is we avoided what was considered an inevitable recession
During and after COVID many "experts" deemed a recession as all but assured. We had a spike in inflation (now managed back down) for a variety of reasons, not the least of which were tariffs, but we avoided a recession. Eventually there will be one, but that is true in any given year. The economy goes up, the economy goes down. I guess if people kee claiming one is coming, someone will eventually be right.
Coach McGuirk Coach McGuirk
It's been smoke and mirrors for a long time, in my non-expert opinion.
A price will eventually have to be paid for the runaway spending.
CrystalCoveHokie CrystalCoveHokie
That’s why it’s good that we have a reserve currency and nukes….
And Taylor Swift.
UTPr0sim UTPr0sim
Shun!!