I'll watch more of the Bowls than the CFP, another 3 weeks, geez.

They conspicuously leave out how the first 20 bowls fared. Plus, the real question is whether or not the % growth on those ratings exceeded the growth of all sports broadcast by ESPN in general. Bowl games between 2 teams with 6 wins are mostly not interesting, games between 2 teams with 9+ wins mostly are. ** Edited by Synaesthesia at 1/2/2026, 5:44:16 PM

If I remember correctly, the ratings this year now include online and app streaming info. And that either wasn’t counted before, or not consistently counted. When I pull together the info for this year I fully expect to see “growth” in viewership across the whole season.

Bowls are financed based on TV Rights, for viewers during the holidays. The amount of $$$ that ESPN and others give to bowls allow them to break even. However, where we really see the attendance problems is bowls close to christmas which makes it tough on fans attending and frankly do you really want to party during christmas in birmingham?? or Mobile??? and regarding fans. many of the bowls who host the lower rung group of 5 will not have a large continent of fans simply for example Ga Southern or RIce will never have the fan base for any gaggle. Bowls are like Thanksgiving basketball tourney's that ESPN fiananced a dispersed places, with the viewers, they willing to finance with rights and really that breaks even for the event sponsor

We'll need to wait to see if New Years week bowls is better. I expect we'll see that somewhere. ESPN won't worry about that as thy focus on viewers, but someone should post it.

but couldn’t tell you what was going on in any of those games outside of Miami’s playoff games and the UVa bowl game. I didn’t even pay attention to the GT or Clemson bowl games. These games are just hard to watch with teams with depleted rosters that are a shell of what their regular season roster had. If the NCAA could lock the portal until after bowl season, limit player transfers to 2 or less transfers within 5 years, and only allow 5 calendar years for eligibility, that might make these greedy and fickle “college” athletes think twice before hopping around. And NIL needs some serious regulation, and I loathe government oversight and intervention as a general rule. NCAA sports have become unrecognizable in the past 10 years and I lose interest more each year.

bowl? Of course the playoffs will not count as a post season bowl.

Not many fans are going to want to sit outside in the August sun to watch a preseason game in Florida, Alabama, Louisiana, Tennessee, Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, California, or South Carolina. A lot more fans will sit outside in December to watch those games in those states because it is a lot colder where they live.

a few in Atlanta, all easy sellouts. Now they limit the teams that can play in them each year, but they have been wildly successful.

in the domes. When the new RFK opens in DC, they will probably have one there at some point. There is a reason why Tampa, Miami, Dallas, Houston, Arizona, and the new Vegas Athletics stadium have domed baseball stadiums because even the locals don't want sit out in the heat during the summer.

the road? Plus FSU and Miami are playing in the first week in September, one week is not much difference in temperature. Also the USCw, Boise and WVU games were hot at Washington’s stadium, but loaded with fans. Compare the attendance to these preseason games versus the empty opt out bowls, and the preseason attendance blows them away, unless it’s a playoff game. ** Edited by Stech at 1/3/2026, 12:17:12 AM

These aren't the cookie cutter stadiums of the 60's and 70's that were multipurpose, these are baseball specific.

is nice in the summer. I doubt they would all be on neutral sites, there just aren’t enough stadiums. As we have seen in the first round of the playoffs, that’s pretty awesome too. I remember doing a summer in Blacksburg at its ~2500 above sea level and enjoying it, I remember working in Boston for a summer and loving it, I remember working in Michigan in the summer and loving, Lots of places have great weather in the summer, some outside of the country too.

were ".....want to sit outside in the August sun...." The air conditioned domes do not have that issue. I think saying "they are already selling them out when they play them" would charitably be termed a stretch.

Plenty of proof this would be better than that, Do people gripe about the weather when little league baseball is played in late August? If so, I haven’t seen it or heard it. I’ll take the northern locations in August over December, and it’s not a stretch or charitable to think many others would do the same. A lot of people summer vacation up north due to the weather. ** Edited by Stech at 1/2/2026, 11:12:03 PM

in the post that started this referred to southern states and you yourself identified Atlanta. In that context it is absolutely charitable to call it a reach.

their games? Come on hoops you are the one doing the stretching here. They can play the games wherever they want to play them,. I never said one word about them all being in the southern states, but athletic contest with fans are already happening in August, it is called Major League Baseball. However, there are more decent weather options in August in the USA than December. You are smart enough to know that, just admit it and stop diverting and digging in.

and reread the thread again. I don't think you comprehend what was said from start to finish in this thread and you are doing what you try to accuse me of now. I'm done with this because we both know how this ends as we've seen it with you before.

However, no problem freezing the fans in Fenway and Yankee stadium in December. I am making an argument, you are insulting me and often others when they disagree with you. You are right, we have seen this many times before. ** Edited by Stech at 1/2/2026, 11:47:46 PM

thread on this topic, player safety and level of risk (school liability associated with heat related deaths). Even you would agree that baseball players don't wear anything close to the amount of protective equipment that football players wear during games. Also, baseball players don't experience the same level of contact from other players that football players experience in practice or in games. For whatever reason you seem fixated on the games while ignoring the fact that football teams need some form of preseason practice to get ready for the games. MLB is lucky because it can do its Spring Training during the winter months. College football isn't so lucky unless you want to push back the start of preseason practice until after Labor Day and reduce the number of games teams play during the season. Remember the NCAA DI bylaws state the earliest a team can start its Fall Practice is 31 days before its first scheduled regular season game. I think the bylaws even limit the number of practices and the types of practices teams can have during those 31 days. NCAA DII, NCAA DIII, NAIA DI, NAIA DII, JUCO, even HS, and even the NFL have all established some sort of guidelines for when teams are allowed to start their Fall Practice. Right now, it is at the end of July or early August. If the start of the regular season gets moved up, then it will move the start of Fall Practice to either early July or mid-July. I doubt teams will be allowed to start Fall Practice before July 1 because that is the start of the NCAA's fiscal year and there could be all sorts of legal and logistical issues to start a sport's season in the previous fiscal year.

games. I played multiple years and I don't remember a single game being as hard as a practice. Now maybe I am bias because we lost 1 game in 4 years and our coaches made practice way harder than games. However, I thought games were much easier than practice.

do any research on heat related deaths in football, then you will see they majority of them occur either during Fall Practice before the first game is even played and a smaller percentage during Spring Practice/offseason workouts. Now it is possible these players had underlying medical conditions that helped contribute to their deaths. FWIW in July 2025, 2 HS players, 1 from Memphis and 1 from Atlanta, collapsed and died during practice as their teams were preparing for the upcoming season. Joshua Henderson, 16 from Memphis, is believed to have died from a heat stroke. "Even in college football or the NFL, you'll see players struggling in the warmer climates during games in August and September. Everyone loves outdoor football, but there's a reason why most players and teams will prefer games indoor in air conditioned stadiums. Of course, that's not really possible at the high school level, but these tragedies continue to show how important it is for schools to properly hydrate, rest and take care of their student athletes, especially in the summer." There is a reason college football has evolved from the Junction Boys days. If colleges attempt to try to go back to those days for offseason workouts and Fall Practices, then they better be prepared to open up their wallets because they don't stand a chance in court. Then again, I guess that is 1 more cost they can pass onto their boosters to cover.

me that question. ** Edited by Stech at 1/3/2026, 6:52:16 PM

impacting when Fall Practice begins. Basically, the schools will not leave the official start of Fall Practice as it is now AND make Week 0 officially Week 1 because it isn't enough time to get the players physically ready to handle the first game. Hence why any discussions on when schools can play their first regular season games can't avoid discussing the potential increase in liability because Fall Practice will now begin in mid or early July instead of late July/early August. Particularly when you consider less than 50% of DI-FBS and DI-FCS schools have any sort of dome, temporary or permanent, they can use to practice in to get out of the summer heat and humidity. The percentage may even be less than 25% even before you start to factor in DII and DIII schools which could impacted by the change because DI-FCS schools are allowed to play DII schools and DII schools are allowed to play DIII schools. At least this issue isn't exclusively a DI-FBS or a DI issue. If you truly and I mean TRULY want to get your wish and make Week 0, Week -1, Week -2, or however early you want to start the regular season, then the answer lies in solving the liability issue associated with teams practicing in early/mid-July in the summer heat and humidity. If you are able to come up with a solution and enough schools buy it, then you have a chance your wish will come to fruition. Otherwise, fans may get sound bites indicating schools want to start earlier and it never go anywhere because when the schools start to hash out the details they can't find a way to overcome the liability issue. No school wants cut multi-million dollar checks because the family of a dead football player won their wrongful death lawsuit in court. Let along multiple multi-million dollar checks because a program experienced multiple deaths in the same season or within few years apart of each other. IIWII and probably a factor why we don't currently see more neutral site games in Week 0 and Week 1 compared to the number of bowls that are played during the holiday season. The other major factor is not as many time slots since a lot more people are off from work and school during the holiday season compared to the month of August when you factor in bowl games are played during the work week and even in the middle of the work day. As a result, there would be more direct competition between games which ESPN doesn't want since ESPN events currently owns 17 bowl games and all the neutral site games that are broadcasted on the ESPN Family of Networks. That would be bad for business compared to the status quo which you don't like for various reasons.

for schools every year and I don't see the impact you are talking about. However, I respect you feel differently from me on this and it will be interesting to see if it ever changes.

received a waiver from the NCAA. 17.12.4 First Contest. [FBS/FCS] An institution shall not play its first contest (game or scrimmage) with outside competition in football prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day (see Figure 17-2). (Revised: 1/11/89, 1/9/96 effective 8/1/96, 1/14/97, 5/12/05) 17.12.4 First Contest. (Revised: 1/11/89, 1/9/96 effective 8/1/96, 1/14/97, 5/12/05, 6/25/25 effective 8/1/26) 17.12.4.1 Exception -- Institutions That Compete in Hawaii. [FBS/FCS] An institution that is scheduled to play a regular-season game in Hawaii may play its first permissible contest with outside competition on the Saturday prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day. If the institution's first opponent of the season is not a member institution located in Hawaii, the institution’s first opponent of the season may also play its first contest (game or scrimmage) with outside competition on the Saturday prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day. (Adopted: 4/28/16 effective 8/1/16) 17.12.4.1 First Contest -- Bowl Subdivision. [FBS] In bowl subdivision football, an institution shall not play its first contest (game or scrimmage) with outside competition before the Thursday preceding Labor Day (see Figure 17-2). (Adopted: 6/25/25 effective 8/1/26) 17.12.4.1.1 Exception -- Institutions That Compete in Hawaii -- Bowl Subdivision. An institution that is scheduled to play a regular-season game in Hawaii may play its first permissible contest with outside competition on the Saturday prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day. If the institution's first opponent of the season is not a member institution located in Hawaii, the institution’s first opponent of the season may also play its first contest (game or scrimmage) with outside competition on the Saturday prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day. (Adopted: 4/28/16 effective 8/1/16, Revised: 6/25/25 effective 8/1/26) 17.12.4.1.2 Exception -- In-Season Foreign Competition -- Bowl Subdivision. An institution that is scheduled to play a regular-season game in a foreign country may play its first permissible contest with outside competition on the Saturday prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day. An institution that uses this exception must provide its student-athletes with five additional days off from all countable athletically related activities during the institution's declared playing season. (Adopted: 5/19/22 effective 8/1/22, Revised: 6/25/25 effective 8/1/26) 17.12.4.2 Exception -- Nationally Televised Contest -- Championship Subdivision. [FCS] In championship subdivision football, an institution may participate in a nationally televised (broadcast or cable; not internet only) contest against a nonconference opponent during the weekend (Saturday-Sunday) before the Thursday preceding Labor Day. Participation in such a contest is limited to one institution per conference per year. An institution that participates in such a contest for two consecutive years may not participate in such a contest in the following year. (Adopted: 4/28/16 effective 8/1/16) 17.12.4.2 First Contest -- Championship Subdivision. [FCS] In championship subdivision football, an institution shall not play its first contest (game or scrimmage) with outside competition prior to the Thursday that is 13 weeks before the FCS Championship selection date (see Figure 17-2). (Adopted: 6/25/25 effective 8/1/26) 17.12.4.3 Exception -- In-Season Foreign Competition. [FBS/FCS] An institution that is scheduled to play a regular-season game in a foreign country may play its first permissible contest with outside competition on the Saturday prior to the Thursday preceding Labor Day. An institution that uses this exception must provide its student-athletes with five additional days off from all countable athletically related activities during the institution's declared playing season. (Adopted: 5/19/22 effective 8/1/22) These bylaws have allowed the NCAA to keep the number of waiver requests down because they are quite specific. Likewise, the liability issue is a somewhat moot point because there are other bylaws that are specific for Fall Practice and when schools do receive a waiver to assist them in lowering there risk. 17.12.2 Length of Playing Season. [FBS/FCS] The length of an institution's playing season in football shall be limited to the period of time between the start of preseason practice (see Bylaw 17.12.3) and the end of the regular playing season (see Bylaw 17.12.5), except as provided in Bylaw 17.12.7 (see Bylaw 17.12.4 for restrictions on first contest dates). 17.12.3 Practice. [FBS/FCS] 17.12.3.1 First Practice Date. [FBS/FCS] An institution shall not commence official preseason football practice sessions, for the varsity, junior varsity or freshman team, before 31 days before its first scheduled intercollegiate game. Before its first scheduled intercollegiate game, an institution may not engage in more than 25 on-field practices. (Revised: 1/11/89, 4/14/03, 4/24/03 effective 5/1/03, 4/28/05, 1/18/18, 6/11/18, 5/18/22) 17.12.3.1.1 Exception. [FBS/FCS] An institution that has prohibitions against athletics activities during a specific day of the week due to religious reasons, may start official preseason football practice sessions one day earlier than the date determined pursuant to Bylaw 17.12.3.1. (Adopted: 4/28/05 effective 5/1/05) 17.12.3.4 Seven-Day Acclimatization Period. [FBS/FCS] In football, preseason practice shall begin with a seven-day acclimatization period for both first-time participants (e.g., freshmen and transfers) and continuing student-athletes. All student-athletes, including walk-ons who arrive to preseason practice after the first day of practice or who begin practice at any other point in the playing season, are required to undergo a seven-day acclimatization period. The seven-day acclimatization period shall be conducted as follows: (Adopted: 4/24/03 effective 5/1/03, Revised: 4/28/05 effective 8/1/05, 7/18/05, 12/13/05, 4/27/06, 12/15/06, 1/4/08, 4/28/16 effective 8/1/16, 4/26/17, 1/18/18, 6/11/18, 1/23/19, 5/19/21, 10/27/21) (a) An institution may not conduct administrative activities (e.g., team pictures, etc.) other than those permitted prior to or on the academic orientation day (e.g., compliance-related activities, medical examinations, individual photographs) prior to the first permissible date of practice. Conditioning, speed, strength or agility tests may not occur on any day prior to the start of the seven-day acclimatization period. (b) During the seven-day period, participants shall not engage in more than one on-field practice per day, not to exceed three hours in length. (1) Exception -- During the seven-day acclimatization period, an institution has the option of conducting one on-field practice per day, not to exceed three hours in length, or one on-field testing session (speed, conditioning or agility tests) per day, not to exceed one hour in length and one on-field practice, not to exceed two hours in length. In addition, an institution may conduct one one-hour walk-through session per day of the acclimatization period pursuant to Bylaw 17.02.22. Student-athletes must be provided with at least three continuous hours of recovery time between any sessions (testing, practice or walk-through) occurring that day. During this time, studentathletes may not attend any meetings or engage in other athletically related activities (e.g., weight lifting); however, time spent receiving medical treatment and eating meals may be included as part of the recovery time. If an institution conducts only a walk-through on a particular day during the acclimatization period, that day does not count toward the required seven days of acclimatization, but the walk-through counts toward the limit of 25 onfield practices in the preseason practice period. (c) First-time participants and continuing students shall not be required to practice separately. (d) During the first two days of practice or testing activity, helmets and spider pads shall be the only protective equipment student-athletes may wear. During the next three days of practice or testing activity, helmets, spider pads and shoulder pads shall be the only pieces of protective equipment student-athletes may wear. On the sixth day of practice or testing activity, student-athletes may practice in full pads. (e) An institution shall provide student-athletes with one day off during the seven-day acclimatization period. The required day off may occur as early as the second day or as late as the seventh day. 17.12.3.4.1 Exception -- National Service Academies. [FBS] First-time participants (e.g., freshmen and transfers) who will be attending a national service academy and who have completed basic military training immediately prior to preseason practice are not required to complete the acclimatization period. (Adopted: 4/29/04 effective 8/1/04, Revised: 12/15/06) 17.12.3.5 Preseason Activities After Acclimatization Period. [FBS/FCS] The remaining 19 on-field preseason practice sessions after the acclimatization period shall be conducted as follows: (Adopted: 4/24/03 effective 5/1/03, Revised: 12/15/06, 4/24/14, 4/14/17, 5/19/21, 10/8/21, 10/27/21) (a) General. (1) Multiple on-field practice sessions shall not be conducted on the same day; (2) Student-athletes shall not engage in more than three hours of on-field practice activities per day; (3) A walk-through is not considered an on-field activity; however, if a walk-through is conducted on a day in which no other on-field activities occur, the walk-through must be included in the limit of 25 on-field practices in the preseason practice period. In championship subdivision football, on-field walk-throughs shall not exceed a total of two hours per day; and (4) Student-athletes must be provided with at least three continuous hours of recovery time between an on-field practice session and a walk-through. During this time, student-athletes may not engage in physical athletically related activities (e.g., weight lifting). Time spent in team meetings, film review, receiving medical treatment and eating meals may be included as part of the recovery time. (b) Protective Equipment Restrictions. (1) Up to eight on-field practice sessions may be conducted in full pads; (2) During at least five on-field practice sessions, protective equipment is restricted to not more than helmets and spider pads; (3) During the remaining on-field practice sessions, protective equipment is restricted to not more than helmets, spider pads and/or shoulder pads; and (4) On-field practice sessions may be conducted in less protective equipment than the maximum restrictions noted above. (c) Contact Restrictions. (1) Full contact (tackling to the ground) is only permitted during an on-field practice session in full pads; (2) An institution shall not conduct more than two consecutive days of full contact (tackling to the ground) practices. A full contact practice during the acclimatization period counts toward this limit; (3) An institution shall not conduct more than a total of 75 minutes of full contact (tackling to the ground) within any one on-field practice session other than during the two permissible scrimmages; and (4) An institution shall not conduct more than two scrimmages during the preseason practice period. A scrimmage is a practice devoted primarily (greater than 50 percent of practice time) to 11-on-11, full contact (tackling to the ground) activities. A scrimmage counts as one of the eight permissible practices in full pads and may include more than 75 minutes of full contact (tackling to the ground). If the schools amendment the bylaws so schools no longer need a waiver to play Week 0 games because Week 0 officially becomes the start of the regular season, then it is likely all of these bylaws will be impacted in some way. It is even possible schools will be forced to change some/most/all of the bylaws dealing with Fall Practice. Most likely the schools would add more restrictions (i.e. fewer practices, fewer minutes of full contact, more down time between practice and walkthroughs, etc.) to try to offset the increase in risk to heat and humidity. A byproduct of the change could end up being sloppier Week 0 and even Week 1 games because teams aren't as well prepared going into the season as they were in the past. At least I wouldn't assume the only change is moving up the start of the regular season. For the record, I am not opposed to the idea of Week 0 becoming the official start of the regular season. However, I have become very familiar with the NCAA DI Manual over the years and I know the school reps on the NCAA Oversight Committee is involved in the process to get bylaws added and changed in the manual for each of the 3 division levels. So I always ask myself "Why was this bylaw added to the manual?" Once I think I have found the answer, then the follow-up question is typically "If this bylaw is removed or changed, then what is the potential fallout of this change?" It is this question where the level of risk/liability issue came into play for me. Not only for the school, but the coaches, staff, and players too because the change could have an impact on their level of risk. Given that in 2021 the University of Maryland settled with the family of late football player Jordan McNair for $3.5 million, it led me to the conclusion that the schools won't willing accept the additional risk without at least adding more precautious to the bylaws to offset the increase and potentially harm the product on the field. There is a reason the schools have been slow to change some of the bylaws in their manuals. Regardless whether it requires the support of the other 2 division levels or not. Managing risk levels is as likely of a reason as any other.

when the regular season can start or not. However, it is an answer to your question below why the schools haven't already changed the bylaws to move some/most of the bowl games to the start of the season. Likewise, I haven't found any reports to suggest majority of the schools are favor of changing the bylaws to that idea at this time. At best the idea is currently still at the exploratory/review phase (any proposal is likely still with the Oversight Committee unless it has already been disapproved). Now whether it gains any traction to go anywhere in the future remains to be seen. Currently the only people I see proposing the idea are mostly people not directly employed by any school and/or who really don't have any skin in the game if it ever goes south for whatever reason.

played in an air conditioned dome, plus indicating they were all sellouts. Saying they were all sellouts is a stretch, particularly v USC-e this past season. This is what Hoops is referencing. He’s not disputing baseball games being played outside in the heat.

If he just says USC wasn’t a *sell out, instead of this charitable stretch crap, it would have been an entirely different conversation. However, he puts digs in his post, not just for me, but others too. Thanks for clarifying, “if” that was what he was saying. *I wasn’t there, but it sure looked pretty full to me, not to mention the Bama games against us have looked full. Bottom line is they are way better attendance for preseason games versus postseason games except the playoffs.

And probably others that were following the thread.

RJ. The discussion thread can speak for itself I believe.

change the rules. That was the point of my post, before you insulted me your normal passive aggressive way. Now please stick to the topic and tell me why if they allowed them, why they could not play preseason bowls? Weather? Wy not? Can we please have a mature conversation on the topic, I change my mind with a good argument all the time. Happy to do it this time too. if you stick to the subject matter, here is your chance, take it. I am listening, but keep the passive aggressive insults out.

the discussion thread speaks for itself and if you actually reread it you would see what others have already tried to explain to you.

to belabor the point already made that you chose to ignore . The thread and your part in it stands on its own. I also have no need to watch you slink away again whining about phantom insults and passive aggressive slights when you do not get your way. Again, take your own advice or you can continue to be you.

got it.