Rationalist

Don't get messageboard banter confused for the fanbase at large. No disrespect to the TSL community, but this is a VERY small portion of the fanbase (and a rather demographically narrow one). It is easy to get an over-inflated belief that "everyone" agrees with us because the TSL community might be in agreement. It is sorta the definition of the echo-chamber.

I think fans need to, again, adjust our perception of these things. Personally, I agree with BuffaloTraceHokie that Friday night "should" belong to high school football, but traditions are rarely respected when dollars are involved. I think we can certainly make the games intriguing to a broad audience if we are: 1. winning games, 2. an interesting team to watch, and 3. lean into the "aura" of our HC. Regardless of what people think of him, a fair number of college football fans do think of him. That means they may likely tune in to our games.

Just spending the money won't work, but even Cignetti said - “It takes a village. It takes money,” If you don't do part 1 then part 2 can't make up for millions not spent. Indiana spent almost the same amount on NIL as Miami - just over 21 million, so I think we can argue that Cignettii is relentless and relentlessly demanded money for his roster.

That is very encouraging.

I think it is a bit disingenuous to think of Indiana U as the "David" against all the Goliaths. They have the largest living alumni base and some incredibly wealthy donors (anyone care to guess how much Cuban has invested in the program). As the original poster said, the decision was made 4+ years ago to invest, it was just done quietly. I would argue that it is remarkable that Indiana performed so badly for so long. None of that takes away from the fact that Cignetti had an approach that was clearly effective, and he was able to identify players that could work together effectively and had a high ceiling. Honestly, if you look at Cignetti's tenure at all the places where he was head coach (IUP, Elon, JMU, and, now, Indiana) - it is remarkable.

and also perceive the current state of college football as an unsustainable mess, let's not compare apples to oranges. The service academies are different animals. Equating them with other universities - even ones with programs like VT's Corp of Cadets is not reasonable.

Wenzel could indeed be a linchpin for "allowing" the others to play as they play. Would we all like to see her shoot a bit better - yes; however, we also don't see practice. We don't know the relationships. There is A LOT that goes into coaching and sometimes it might not make good sense from the bleachers, but excellent sense from the seats on the floor.

Dan Patrick had a good segment on this. He has at least one very good source that discussed the changes. The ACC better fix there structure quick OR we will potentially have another 7-5 team in the playoffs.

Please.

Unless you have verifiable sources and documentation, all of this is hearsay and conjecture. I have not seen this factiod confirmed or proven by documentation or a reliable source. So... let's ease up on the "stupid" commentary when evaluating the administration based upon this wet dream.

I know people have gotten use to individuals that air all of their laundry online or through news releases, press conferences, etc. The world seems to feed off of people that emote everything online. You are correct - Whit does not work that way. There are many others that don't. In fact, I don't think many ADs are that way. True success and respectability rarely is packaged with this approach to dealing with conflict and challenges. Unless you have a position within VT Athletics or a relative that has an office down the hall from Babcock et al. then I don't think we can definitely say that there "wasn't a peep" from Whit about it. Did he go to the press? No. Does that approach ever accomplish anything? No. Please be aware that I am actually not advocating for Whit. Frankly, I think it is time for a new voice, but I hope that the "new voice" isn't anything resembling the Penn State PSU or Bubba Cunningham or any of the blowhards that make the news with the whining and crying. Give me effective any day of the week. Quick! Who is the AD at Alabama? How about Texas Tech?

I don't think it is going to be that bad. Granted - I am skeptical it will be dynamic, but I think it will actually be consistent and have an identity. If we find the right players (i.e. Running Back, O-Line, TE). What I do believe it means is recruiting and portal acquisition are going to be critical.

In 2024 - they lost 3 games by 10+ points and one of those was to BC. In 2023 - they lost 7 games by 10+ points and if wasn't for a Wofford win, they would have only one 2 games. Sounds familiar. So, they are a pretty typical mid-level ACC team, but they do play aggressive.

The information was earlier and more accurate. So, it all depends on your appetite. If you don't mind waiting for the news and wading through a LOT of poor conjecture, then, you are correct. However, if you prefer a better level of info delivered with more confidence - subscribe.

locally that is stating that Franklin is currently the primary target. But he is also saying there is a big gap between him being the primary target and their being a deal in place. I don't think it is a reach to say, the committee is very interested in Franklin and some contact between the parties has occurred, but that's about it right now.

Not sure that the data supports your assessment. Two losing seasons in 14 years. Yes, FSU in 2017 was pretty bad and he could never get TAM over the hump, but I don't think he ruined either program. He certainly left Mike Elko enough talent and FSU proved to be in a bad spot (I would say similar to what Fuente found at VT in a relative sense). Don't love that his teams were poor APR performers, but I don't know that anyone cares about that any more.

In terms of owning the past and talking about the "future," Whit is absolutely no different than Florida's AD, FSU's AD, UVA's AD et al. It isn't a matter of being slimy; it's being a salesperson. Where VT is today is partially Whit's fault, partially the BOV's fault, partially John Ballein's fault, and partially the fault of the historical entities (previous ADs, previous administrators, etc. etc.). There is plenty of blame to go around. As a fan, it is frustrating, but let's not assume a level of negligence and criminality when it is simply being unsuccessful with a general lack of insight and forward thinking.

But FFS, your envy is showing badly. The facts surrounding Sands tenure will be measured in what he did for the UNIVERSITY not simply athletics. This appears to be hard to wrap your head around, but please grasp that our research spending has increased year-over-year by significant dollars and is measured close to half a billion dollars. I love football too, but lets have a little perspective here.

It isn't really as simple as "I don't care" or "I don't need it" so I don't think we should pay for it. There are much better arguments against increased funding than that one.

Arians made a sizable donation to VT football. Not the right choice for a coach, I agree, but having people like him "associated" and invested in the program does make sense.

He had a winning record in only 6 of his 15 seasons as a head coach. I think the perception of Gruden is much much rosier than the reality of Gruden.

But, again, most teams have those outside of the top 10-15. Have we been consistently a middling team? I would say, yes. However, we had some decent years in the 80's (8 and 9 win seasons) when I began watching as well as numerous 7 and 8 win seasons in the 60's. You said, "VT football has historically been bad" and that just isn't an accurate statement. I also don't believe $50 million is likely to happen, but, if I am reading the tea leaves, I think we are going to see a cash infusion and some significant changes in the way the athletic department is run. Will it amount to us reaching Clemson or Miami levels? I don't think so, but if we could find a savvy coach with some decent recruiting/evaluation skills, I think we could get back to 8/9/10 win seasons and maybe even contend for the ACC on the rare occasion. I would also posit that where college football is today isn't likely to be where it is in 5-10 years. I think there are significant changes still to come as universities come to grips with this animal.

empirically false. As someone pointed out, we were a strong team for almost 20 years. Additionally, we did have a few years prior to Beamer where we were decent to good. We have NOT been historically bad. However, we have not been a program that has historically been in the upper echelon of D1 football. That isn't what we are looking for right now. Getting ourselves back in to that status where we are ranked 20-35 is very achievable with the occasional chance into the top 10-20. That means you are a consistent winner with the occasional win over a top tier team. I think VT football fans would support and welcome that, but we have to acknowledge our situation - the program needs an overhaul. First step - admit we are not on the right path Second step - pull yourself out of the mire and start making changes towards the positive Will it be expensive? Yep. Will it be quick? Probably not. Will it require some innovative thinking? Almost certainly. ** Edited by Rationalist at 9/7/2025, 10:57:32 PM

How can it be enjoyable to sit in misery and stew that much? BTW: Love your avatar!

Softball at VT still wouldn't be where it is today without the monetary success of Football. "The hand that feeds" sorta thing...

New car, caviar, four star daydream Think I'll buy me a football (basketball) team ** Edited by Rationalist at 4/22/2025, 1:50:50 PM

Folks, you are giving this young woman far too much of your time and headspace. She was a really good player for our women's basketball team. Would she have helped this year? Yea, some. But, she decided to go elsewhere. She didn't lie to VT and promise to stay. She didn't hold us hostage or mess up our program with a lot of negativity. She played ball and followed the coach she admired. It is a new era and, based upon year one, I think we are going to land on our feet with CMD.

sounds like time for a hobby or some time away from a keyboard.

The Internet has become the great leveler - not in a good way. Anyone with a phone/keyboard can post, comment and pontificate. Unfortunately, due to computer hacks (and, yes, I am a programmer, so I am indirectly culpable), we rely on algorithms and suspect logic to "promote" certain commentaries. The cream no longer rises to the top naturally. Now, the sour milk can be much more visible than the quality goods. In other words, we no longer do we turn to experts or some times even know when someone is a true student of the topic. Therefore, I think we need to be careful in "how" we criticize as well as understand the nature of dealing with young adults as athletes. I think being critical is important - but we need to apply it properly and in proper doses.

Not a laughingstock because few people care about a late season game between two losing programs.

I actually assumed Woolwine might actually become employed by VT, but I suppose not.

But I thought that WB mentioned in his after-season report that Kelly Woolwine would be fulfilling some role similar to a GM for VT. No details were provided of course, but I remember there being something along those lines mentioned when Bill Roth asked about whether VT was going to take a similar approach to Stanford with a GM.

Right now our team is doing very well. Quite fun to watch - Lancerlot in Roanoke VA is home ice.

Not sure what your source of information might be, but you have me intrigued.

I sent two to VT as well as myself. I support the academic programs from which they graduated and I support two women's sports, but, I also realize that money is king in modern DI athletics. Without donors, VT athletics will remain middling and underwhelming. It could remain that way even with money, but I don't think there is a third option.

25 times, possibly. But the wear-and-tear is just too much to have an RB carry 30+ times. RE: Temperament and toughness - I agree. We really don't see as much as we think we see during the 3ish hours of game time.

You could make the "resources" argument. As it stands, under Beamer's watch, we fell behind again in the resource and recruiting race. Fuente's time made it even worse. So, when Pry took over, we had let 10 years (at least) slip past us. Honestly, I was equally spoiled by the golden years of Beamer, but let's not lose sight of the fact that his last four years were mediocre and we struggled to make bowl games. Is Pry = Beamer? No. Nor is it the same league as it was in the 1990s and early 2000s. Could Pry right the ship and get VT competing at a nationally significant level again? I think it is harder than ever to do so.

And neither did Alabama??? Or Kentucky??? I think he's just a genuinely hard to defend.

Can't speak to Notre Dame, but I have yet to be in a stadium that doesn't do the same or very similar to VT.

This isn't unique to VT. This is DI college sports in general and pro sports entirely. Yes, VT has followed the crowd, but, I'll tell ya. It's not any different elsewhere. Not to be ageist because I am close to your age, but, the thing is, we are not the target audience for live sports anymore.

The question is: Is he "just a slightly above average QB" or something more. I think the data leans towards the former. If I were an FSU fan, I would be equally concerned that their supposedly vaunted run game didn't materialize at all and they struggled to stop GT on the ground.

Two of the programs above us (Texas and Texas A&M) were just added and we are actually listed as tied #47 with Texas A&M and Georgia, so you could make a strong argument that only Vanderbilt, Texas, and Florida are really ranked higher. Paul, like many supposed football analysts, do little research and simply cater to the audience. We do love our echo chambers. ** Edited by Rationalist at 7/26/2024, 5:03:30 PM