My thoughts on our shooters....
Good consistent shooters have the following:
1. Slight turn
2. Elbow aligned with hand (no chicken wing)
3. Ball release off pointing or middle finger (or both)
4. Left hand on side of ball - not used in the shot
4a. Some shooter use left thumb flick - ok with that but it can quickly devolve to too much left hand
5. Good arc
6. Natural shooting ability. Some kids shoot perfectly but their brain just can't figure out the right amount of force consistently
Good shooters rarely miss to the left or the right. They are either long or short but straight.
Here's my take on our shooters
Hammond - good form, uses left hand a bit too much. Look at still pics of his shot and you'll see his hand facing forward. It's because he rotates his hand during shot. If he starts missing to the left or right it's because of too much left hand.
Schutt - good form, not enough arc. If you don't shoot with much arc you have to be more accurate on the amount of force you use. I think Schutt would be a lights out shooter if he had more arc in his shot.
Neo - generally good shooting form - he's just mental midget currently when it comes to shooting. No confidence. Sometimes his left hand is more on top of ball instead of side. But I think he's just in a slump. Needs to shoot alot after practice.
Bedford - good form except he uses his left hand in his shot. Sometimes alot. Also, sometimes ball seems to come off his 3rd, 4th, and pinkie fingers. That's what I see sometimes live, but I've never seen a still photo showing it. Using alot of left hand (and maybe the bad release at times) make him a streaky shooter. He also misses badly to the left or right which means he's not a consistent shooter.
Hansberry - shoots with a chicken wing. Is prone to being streaky and inconsistent because of that.
Lawal - unfortunately someone drilled into him feet and shoulders square to the basket. No turn in his stance. Too much tension in his shot - he's prone to inconsistency.
You guys agree with this, disagree? Lemme know.
27 Replies
6mo
By the time someone gets to college. This is for a number of reasons but the 2 biggest are that they've (hopefully) gotten tens of thousands of reps in shooting a certain way, so knocking that all down to rebuild can take much longer than you're able to wait
The second is that you have very limited time with your players off-season, and you certainly don't want to change your shot in-season
So the best way to make someone shoot a better percentage at the college level is to make more subtle changes to make their current form more repeatable. As someone said down the thread consistency is better than form at this stage.
If I'm teaching college kids I don't really care about the turn, I don't really care about the middle finger flick. I care a little more about getting your elbow under the ball.
But some things you didn't mention that are bigger teaching points with older players (i.e. college level):
Spreading your hand out across the ball for better control
1-2 rhythm when catching for a shot (catch on 2 feet if theyre an advanced shooter)
Landing in the same place you jumped from (drawing a box around their feet and have them make 100 shots from the box, any makes landing outside the box don't count)
You can do a lot of things differently that you developed in childhood, but if you do those things above you'll turn yourself into a serviceable shooter
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
I guess some high school and AAU coaches are just happy to have a great athlete and don’t want to risk breaking down their form to make correction. Med Hill was a particular one that comes to mind. He shot with his right hand with the ball to the left side of his head. Gurdak has great form on his free throws and I can see him making 3s later in his career.
My high school coach completely changed my hideous form as a freshman and I’m amazed this doesn’t happen for others at that age.
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
6mo
major left eye dominant will do that to a righty
(In response to this post by VTKev80)
6mo
Not sure how big the box is. I think you should jump forward slightly. If you are working on making sure they are jumping toward the basket I agree. If you are working on them jumping up and coming down I disagree. For those interested - here's a video showing what I mean.
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
6mo
We are talking about coaching bad shooters to average or average shooters to above average. The most common issue in shooting that you see at the college level is a variance from a strong shooting cylinder (so like having your elbow out, moving the ball from side to side, shooting across your body, etc) and the most common of those issues is what is getting Avdalas in trouble...leaning back. If you have everything else under control then jumping slightly forward is great, but if you can have them concentrate on landing in the same spot then you start to see their chest come forward over their toes. Then what naturally happens in a game is they jump slightly forward but with a balanced launch and land.
Here's the fundamental difference between what you're preaching and what is possible in college
You are trying to build from scratch. Teaching all the right things if you were going to teach someone age 13-17 how to shoot a basketball. When they arrive to campus you simply don't have time to do that. You have to pick the things that are both most important and won't significantly change their comfort in shooting the ball. If theyre not comfortable shooting the ball, they could have been taught the best shooting form in the world and it won't matter
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
At least for now. He needs to work on playing stronger. Draw fouls.
And LOL, I would make him lose the arm sleeve that he spends most of the game tugging on.
And one more while we are at it. Lose the toe bounce thing on defense.
Yeah, I've never played competitive basketball. Just a long time fan going back to the Russell and Sam Jones Celtic days.
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
6mo
I see your point with the box in regard to fixing Neo's shot. To me - you are trying to get him back to his original shooting form and I agree with that. I don't think any changes need to be made - especially in season.
I really didn't think he was leaning back too much, I'll watch next time. To me he's just lost confidence. He needs to stop trying to guide the ball and shoot.
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
H
Hoke
6mo
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
6mo
I think if you have good shooting form you are more likely to be a more consistent shooter.
I think Neo and Schutt have a chance to come out of their slump and shoot better and more consistently from game to game.
Hansberry and Lawal will at best be streaky shooters because of their form.
My point being I think we can hope Neo and Schutt get hot and consistent. We need that for the stretch run.
Schutt has the best form of all, he just shoots with no arc so there is less room for error. But he always shoots straight. He's either off the back of the rim or hitting the front.
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
6mo
But I promise you that if you had 5 min with someone you'd be better off aligning what they currently do shooting-wise than breaking their shot down and building it back up
This is why the NBA has more shot changes than college. That's their job. There are no restrictions (or way less) on the amount of time you can spend teaching.
You simply don't have time to do proper teaching AND get everything else taught that you need to teach
Mike Young has turned around a double digit number of shooters in his VT career from PJ Horne to Justyn Mutts to Keve Aluma. And they've all had wonky shots, but he leaned into what could make them consistent.
With unlimited hours could they have been better? Sure. But trying to teach them proper form would have only yielded results not worth the time
** Edited by GCHokie34 at 1/28/2026, 11:53:46 AM
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
I don't think we tear down their shots. I don't think we make any changes to their shots.
I reviewed peoples shots to see if they had pretty good to good shooting forms. I think Schutt and Neo have mostly good shot forms and are more likely to shoot better and more consistently going forward without any changes. I think it is harder for Lawal and Hansberry to shoot better and more consistently going forward.
But we can't change anything during the season. And I think you're right, there isn't time to make these changes in college. They are what they are in college.
Plus I'm a MY fan. Hope he stays around many more years and coaches VT.
** Edited by HokieHill at 1/28/2026, 12:25:42 PM
(In response to this post by GCHokie34)
6mo
. . . course this the result of the mechanics you mention prior to release.
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
S
Stech
6mo
we get court side tickets behind the team for the Final Four Virginia Tech games for payment. Going Cignetti!! 🤣
PS You are dead on, add some mental work to it and we got this!!🤣🤣
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
Don't like the hate directed his way. Just makes it harder to get out of it - but I'm sure MY is encouraging him and hopefully the team is too. We need his shooting and good play on offense.
(In response to this post by Stech)
S
Stech
6mo
You don’t build a bridge by knocking it down, then why would you do that to a Hokie who wants to succeed?!?!?
Probably because you have mental problems, and you take it out on someone else. It’s a reflection on the hater, not the one being hated. He needs solutions to the challenge, not hate!!
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
too much thinking and start second guessing. let the muscle memory take over.
if you look at the top ten tennis and golf pros, do they have the same swing? is there a perfect swing? it's the individual physiology and biomechanics.
** Edited by Windows NT at 1/28/2026, 9:57:29 AM
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
. . . to be aiming the ball. Result? Airball beneath the rim :(
(In response to this post by Windows NT)
6mo
maybe thinking too much... too many variables that will develop a yip. he has to learn to commit to a shot and just shoot
** Edited by Windows NT at 1/28/2026, 11:48:50 AM
(In response to this post by MidloHokie)
6mo
(In response to this post by Windows NT)
6mo
Kids are taught to shoot. If you drill the 5 things I mentioned from when they are young they will be good shooter.
(In response to this post by Windows NT)
6mo
(In response to this post by HokieHill)
6mo
Of course that assumes there's nothing really bad in your form. You need to shoot it the same way every time. When you start changing a player's form, you risk their their brain interfering with their muscles. And you risk their form becoming inconsistent. Sometimes that can be a necessary risk. But it takes time and a lot a lot of repetition to retrain your muscle memory. So a good coach needs to know when a player needs to change their form, versus when a player just needs to spend more time practicing their shot. And it's risky to try to change a player's form during the middle of a season. There's just not the time.
(In response to this post by Windows NT)
6mo
At this point we are what we are. I point form out because some guys are in a slump and have a better chance of coming out of it and shooting consistently for the rest of the season due to good form. I put Neo and Schutt in this category. Some are what they are and will be up and down for the season. I put Hansberry and Lawal in this category.
(In response to this post by wwhokie1)
6mo
"So a good coach needs to know when a player needs to change their form"...good coaches work with improving the form
** Edited by Windows NT at 1/28/2026, 10:35:24 AM
** Edited by Windows NT at 1/28/2026, 10:46:12 AM
(In response to this post by wwhokie1)
6mo
Some shooters - like Steph Curry - are a 1 motion shooter without much of a jump.
Other shooters - like Kobe - are 2 motion shooters. They bring the ball up and little back while they jump, then they motion forward at the top of their jump. Neo is a 2 motion shooter.
There are alot of other variables but the 5 things I mention should be part of a good shooters form.
(In response to this post by Windows NT)